Title: kvass-msg
Subject: Russian drink from bread or grains.
Author: Edited by Mark S. Harris
Last saved by: Mark S. Harris
Keywords: beverage, alcohol, Russia, Russian, grain, bread

kvass-msg - 12/13/13

Russian drink made from bread or grains. Recipes.

NOTE: See also the files: beer-msg, beverages-msg, p-bottles-msg, wine-msg, rice-msg, grains-msg, bread-msg, brewing-msg, fd-Russia-msg.

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This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I  have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

I  have done  a limited amount  of  editing. Messages having to do  with separate topics  were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the  message IDs  were removed to save space and remove clutter.

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make  no claims  as  to the accuracy  of  the information  given  by the individual authors.

Please  respect the time  and  efforts of  those who have written  these messages. The  copyright status  of these messages  is  unclear  at this time. If  information  is  published  from  these  messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

Thank you,
    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 29 Nov 1993 16:12:58 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

Greetings from Balderik,

I must agree with Solveig, and add that I would be VERY
surprised if Kvass (as described in the recipes I've seen)
was the common drink in Medieval Russia.

I don't have any documentary evidence regarding brewing practices in
Russia during this period, so this is my *opinion*.

The recipes for Kvass that I've seen strike me as being quick and
dirty recipes for a light alcoholic beverage.  They rely on sugar
as their chief source of fermentable sugars.  I think it's safe to
say that sugar, if available, would have been reserved for other
purposes in medieval Russia.  Of course, honey could be substituted.

The bread involved
would provide starch, flavour, and some trace nutrients for the
yeast.  The starches would not be fermentable by brewing yeast.
In period, it is conceivable that the fermentation would include
microorganisms capable of breaking down the starches, but in that
case, the flavour of the beverage would be *radically* different
from what we would obtain using brewers yeast.  The kvass recipes
I've seen look like nothing so much as attempts to simulate a 
rye beer when you don't have the materials (malted rye), equipment,
or time to produce a 'real' beer (no insult intended). 

The whole point of beer was that malted grain was a relatively cheap
source of fermentable sugars.  The trouble is that you have to 'mash'
it to convert the starch in the grain to fermentable sugars.  This
requires a certain amount of equipment, knowledge, time, etc.  Soaking
bread in hot water to extract a bit of flavour (as per kvass recipes)
is a poor use of the grain by comparison (especially since you have to
make the grain into bread in the first place).  If you can't make beer
from grain, but have rye bread and cheap sugar/honey available, it
may be a viable option.  

While I have only seen Finnish recipes for Rye beers, I would not be
surprised if similar Russian recipes exist (anyone got any?).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that without some sort of evidence
otherwise, there are strong reasons to question that Kvass (as described
in modern recipes) was a common drink in medieval Russia.

Cheers, Balderik  

From: mcs at unlinfo.unl.edu (M Straatmann)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 29 Nov 1993 22:43:10 GMT
Organization: University of Nebraska--Lincoln	

cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:
>Greetings from Balderik,

>I must agree with Solveig, and add that I would be VERY
>surprised if Kvass (as described in the recipes I've seen)
>was the common drink in Medieval Russia.

The title _Bread and Salt_by Smith and Christian (see complete 
reference below) goes into length about the role of Kvas in period.  
(quote) "The other common drink of Kievan times was Kvas, a very 
lightly fermented, almost non-alchoholic beer.  Home-made kvas is made
nowadays from malted rye, barley or wheat and rye, wheat or buckwheat 
flour or from pastry, bread, or rusks; sugar, honey, and various 
fruits, berries, and herbs are used to flavor it. A twelth-century 
manuscript mention 'much drink and Kvas' It is this which seems to be 
referred to by Tedaldi, even though the drink he mentioned in 1581 
was made with oats: 'water mashed with oatmeal, then cooked, is the 
general drink; the oats relieves the badness of the water and makes 
the men fat." (p.74) (end quote)  
Kvas seems to have been very prevalent within medieval Russia, the 
"day-to-day drink of most peasants in Russia" (p. 78)

>I don't have any documentary evidence regarding brewing practices in
>Russia during this period, so this is my *opinion*.
These are solid ideas with a logical basis (some I disagree with, but 
hey :-)

>The recipes for Kvass that I've seen strike me as being quick and
>dirty recipes for a light alcoholic beverage.  They rely on sugar
>as their chief source of fermentable sugars.  I think it's safe to
>say that sugar, if available, would have been reserved for other
>purposes in medieval Russia.  Of course, honey could be substituted.
The general impression that I have received is that honey was used for
just that.  It seems to have been exceedingly common, given the 
numerous references to honey meads.  

>The bread involved
>would provide starch, flavour, and some trace nutrients for the
>yeast.  The starches would not be fermentable by brewing yeast.
>In period, it is conceivable that the fermentation would include
>microorganisms capable of breaking down the starches, but in that
>case, the flavour of the beverage would be *radically* different
>from what we would obtain using brewers yeast.  The kvass recipes
>I've seen look like nothing so much as attempts to simulate a 
>rye beer when you don't have the materials (malted rye), equipment,
>or time to produce a 'real' beer (no insult intended). 

>The whole point of beer was that malted grain was a relatively cheap
>source of fermentable sugars.  The trouble is that you have to 'mash'
>it to convert the starch in the grain to fermentable sugars.  This
>requires a certain amount of equipment, knowledge, time, etc.  Soaking
>bread in hot water to extract a bit of flavour (as per kvass recipes)
>is a poor use of the grain by comparison (especially since you have to
>make the grain into bread in the first place).  If you can't make beer
>from grain, but have rye bread and cheap sugar/honey available, it
>may be a viable option.  

I am not much of a brewer, but most of the recipes for kvas that I 
have made that tasted any good were ones which started with rye flour 
and not rye (or other type) bread.  
Beer was also an option, however.  
"Beer is mentioned from the eleventh century onwards. . . .Malt for 
the tax-collector, or justice, at the rate of seven buckets a week 
was specified in part of Russkaya Pravda, the old Russian law, dated 
to the 1030's."

I believe that Kvas was made not because beer couldn't be made, but 
that it was cheaper and easier to make.  It seems to have been more of
a commonly available drink.  

>While I have only seen Finnish recipes for Rye beers, I would not be
>surprised if similar Russian recipes exist (anyone got any?).

Which I did!  

>I guess what I'm trying to say is that without some sort of evidence
>otherwise, there are strong reasons to question that Kvass (as described
>in modern recipes) was a common drink in medieval Russia.
I am not quite sure which recipes you have, but I think that it was 
quite a common drink.  The actual recipes we have are not from period 
(as near as I can find), but some seem to come a lot closer than 
others. 
>Cheers, Balderik

Mikhail Nikolaevich
mcs at unlinfo.unl.edu

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 30 Nov 1993 20:22:39 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

First off, thanks to Mikhail Nikolaevich for his
informative reply.

I think I goofed in assuming that the recipes for Kvass
that I'm familiar with are the same ones that everyone
else has seen.

From what I've seen in Complete Anachronist, rec.crafts.homebrewing,
homebrew-digest, and here on the Rialto, I was under the impression
that Kvass was made strictly from bread, not from (malted) grain.

I thought (incorrectly it would appear), that Kvass was distinct
from beer in that it was a light beverage made from bread.  It looks
like 'Kvass' is just the Russian word for 'small beer', and includes
a wide range of beers made from different grains and flavoured with
an assortment of ingredients.  The bread based recipes would only be
for one type of Kvass (sort of a quick and dirty counterfeit?).
If Kvass is the generic term for such a wide range of small beers,
then I don't doubt that it was the common drink.

So, I suppose my argument would be that granted that Kvass was a 
staple drink in Medieval Russia, Kvass made from bread (as per some
of the recipes I've seen) would probably have been less common
than Kvass made from malted grain (rye, oats, etc.).  

Mikhail, you mention making kvass from 'rye flour'.  Are you sure
it's rye *flour*?  How did you make it from the flour?  From my
understanding of brewing, this shouldn't work. You would have to
use malted rye, which you would then mash to convert the starch to
fermentable sugar.  On the other hand, if it was extract of malted rye
(which could be purchased as a flour-like powder), you would simply
dissolve it in water and proceed.

From what I've heard, in areas where there is a large Finnish population,
one can sometimes find stores that sell rye malt and/or rye malt extract.
(for making sahti and other Finnish rye beers).
Some american mailorder homebrew suppliers offer them as well.
Up this-a way, the homebrew suppliers don't know from malted rye.
While one could make a barley malt based beer and include some unmalted
rye (using the enzymes from the barley to convert the starches in
the rye, as is done in *some* wheat beers and oatmeal stouts), I have
been lead to believe that this won't give the right results as
malted rye is quite different from unmalted rye.  Furthermore, you
would have to use at least 50% barley malt to attain complete conversion,
so the flavour profile would be skewed towards the barley beer side of
the spectrum.

Thanks for straightening that out!
Cheers, Balderik

From: mcs at unlinfo.unl.edu (M Straatmann)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 1 Dec 1993 18:06:24 GMT
Organization: University of Nebraska--Lincoln	

Greetings unto the Rialto and especially unto Balderick!

cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:
>Mikhail, you mention making kvass from 'rye flour'.  Are you sure
>it's rye *flour*?  How did you make it from the flour?  From my
>understanding of brewing, this shouldn't work. You would have to
>use malted rye, which you would then mash to convert the starch to
>fermentable sugar.  On the other hand, if it was extract of malted rye
>(which could be purchased as a flour-like powder), you would simply
>dissolve it in water and proceed.

Sorry about the unclear wording (I need to proof my posts better!!!!!)
The recipe that I am most fond of (with no date, unfortunately!) is as
follows.
"To make it one puts a pailful of water into an earthen vessel, into 
wich one shakes two pounds of barley meal (or rye), half a pound of 
salt, and some honey, more or less according to the wealth of the 
family.  This is placed in the evening in the oven with a moderate 
fire and stirred.  In the morning, it is left for a time to settle, 
the clear liquid is poured of, and it is ready to drink in a few 
days."

I think that the important thing to remember about kvas is it's 
weakness.  The records are much better for mead and vodka than for 
kvas, its alchohol content was so low that it's production was seldom 
recorded for taxation and the like.  

I will have to try the malted barley (or rye).  I have till this point
used rye flour, and the product has turned out, at all stages of 
production, as described in 
all the processes which I have read (not as many as I would like :-)
This is not to say of course, that it is correct.   
My applied knowledge of brewing is rather minimal (and quite limited to 
kvas).  Could you suggest other improvements/variations I might try?  

>From what I've heard, in areas where there is a large Finnish population,
>one can sometimes find stores that sell rye malt and/or rye malt extract.
>(for making sahti and other Finnish rye beers).
>Some american mailorder homebrew suppliers offer them as well.
>Up this-a way, the homebrew suppliers don't know from malted rye.
>While one could make a barley malt based beer and include some unmalted
>rye (using the enzymes from the barley to convert the starches in
>the rye, as is done in *some* wheat beers and oatmeal stouts), I have
>been lead to believe that this won't give the right results as
>malted rye is quite different from unmalted rye.  Furthermore, you
>would have to use at least 50% barley malt to attain complete conversion,
>so the flavour profile would be skewed towards the barley beer side of
>the spectrum.

>Thanks for straightening that out!
>Cheers, Balderik

In curiousity,
Mikhail

From: fnklshtn at AXP3.ACF.NYU.EDU
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 2 Dec 93 02:16:12 GMT
Organization: New York University, NY, NY

cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:
>First off, thanks to Mikhail Nikolaevich for his
>informative reply.
>
>I think I goofed in assuming that the recipes for Kvass
>that I'm familiar with are the same ones that everyone
>else has seen.
>
>From what I've seen in Complete Anachronist, rec.crafts.homebrewing,
>homebrew-digest, and here on the Rialto, I was under the impression
>that Kvass was made strictly from bread, not from (malted) grain.
>
>I thought (incorrectly it would appear), that Kvass was distinct
>from beer in that it was a light beverage made from bread.  It looks
>like 'Kvass' is just the Russian word for 'small beer', and includes
>a wide range of beers made from different grains and flavoured with
>an assortment of ingredients.  The bread based recipes would only be
>for one type of Kvass (sort of a quick and dirty counterfeit?).
>If Kvass is the generic term for such a wide range of small beers,
>then I don't doubt that it was the common drink.

Hold it, hold it!
Someone's Russian dictionary sucks!
(and it's not mine since I learned by living not by going to classes)
The word for beer is Pivo. This includes beers from all sorts of grains.
Kvas is a non-alcoholic beverage (or, if alcoholic, it has less alcohol than
toothpaste) made from bread.
SCA Kvas tastes nothing like real Kvas.
Why am I speaking so certainly?
Because I lived in the USSR as a small boy. Kvas was what we drank on hot summer
days. We drank big mugs on empty stomachs and never even got tipsy. Further,
contrary to popular belief, alcohol is illegal to sell to children in USSR
while Kvas was sold by government salesmen in government stores to children.

Incidentally, if you wanna try the real thing go to your closest Russian
comunity. I know they make and import it in Brighton Beach (in New York).

I wonder if the SCAdian brewers ever tasted the real Kvas.
I wonder how many of the other things we do are just as unrelated to their
originals.

Nahum 

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Kvass and Reconstruction in the SCA
Date: 2 Dec 1993 14:53:18 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

fnklshtn at AXP3.ACF.NYU.EDU writes:
|> In article <2dga2f$bjo at bmerha64.bnr.ca>, cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:

...stuff deleted...

|> Hold it, hold it!
|> Someone's Russian dictionary sucks!
|> (and it's not mine since I learned by living not by going to classes)
|> The word for beer is Pivo. This includes beers from all sorts of grains.
|> Kvas is a non-alcoholic beverage (or, if alcoholic, it has less alcohol than
|> toothpaste) made from bread.
|> SCA Kvas tastes nothing like real Kvas.

You mean SCA Kvas tastes nothing like real (modern) Kvas.  I don't think
we can say very much conclusively about the taste of real medieval kvas.

|> Why am I speaking so certainly?
|> Because I lived in the USSR as a small boy. Kvas was what we drank on hot summer
|> days. We drank big mugs on empty stomachs and never even got tipsy. Further,
|> contrary to popular belief, alcohol is illegal to sell to children in USSR
|> while Kvas was sold by government salesmen in government stores to children.

Perhaps modern kvas is deliberately made non-alcoholic precisely so that it
can be legally sold in this way.
I would not base my definition of a medieval ginger ale on the 'ginger ale'
we find being sold to children today (wow, that may just be a perfect analogue).

|> Incidentally, if you wanna try the real thing go to your closest Russian
|> comunity. I know they make and import it in Brighton Beach (in New York).

But would it be like real medieval kvas?  I'm not saying that it wouldn't be,
I'm asking.  Mikhail's references would seem to indicate that today's Kvas
may not be the same as the Kvas of days gone by.  If you went to Burton-on-Trent
you could probably get some wonderful British Ales.  But would they be
representative of medieval British Ales?  I would guess not, but never having
tasted a medieval British ale, or even conducted any extensive study of medieval
brewing techniques, I can't say for certain.
 
|> I wonder if the SCAdian brewers ever tasted the real Kvas.

Next time you crack a bottle of 1050 vintage Kvas, give me a call. I'd be 
genuinely delighted to taste it ;).  

|> I wonder how many of the other things we do are just as unrelated to their
|> originals.

Which 'originals'?  Modern Russian Kvas may be just as far removed from
medieval kvas as SCA kvas (not that I have good things to say about the
SCA kvass recipes I've seen).  This is precisely the question we're trying
to answer.  What was medieval Kvas like?  Can we safely assume that it
resembles modern kvas in anything more than a superficial manner?
Mikhail's references seem to indicate that there were many ways of making
kvass so trying to pin down a narrow definition might be futile.

To answer your question, I would guess that alot of what we do in the SCA
is unrelated to the 'originals', and it's often because we assume that modern
things are interchangeable with their medieval counterparts:

Modern leather is the same as medieval leather
Modern steel is the same as medieval steel
Modern Ale is the same as medieval ale
Modern cloth is the same as medieval cloth

but hey, that horse is little more than a pile of bleached bones at this point,
so I won't molest it any further.

Cheers, Balderik

From: mcs at unlinfo.unl.edu (M Straatmann)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: kvas reference
Date: 29 Nov 1993 22:46:24 GMT
Organization: University of Nebraska--Lincoln	

In my last post discussing kvas with Balderik, I promised the 
reference and then promptly forgot to include it.  Here it is:

Bread and Salt
A social and economic history of food and drink in Russia.
R.E.F. Smith and David Christian
Cambridge University Press 1984
ISBN - 0 521 25812X

Good book,
misha

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 13:01:08 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass

Mark Harris wrote:
> Earlier today, Monday, May 12, Adamantius said:
> >I, for one, will stick to my kvass!
> 
> I have heard a little about this drink but not since it was last discussed
> on the Rialto several years ago. I think at that time there was an
> argument about whether it was made of bread or grains. 
> 
> I would love to hear more about this drink or your recipe(s).

I don't have my recipe in front of me, but I remember it fairly well. It
is fairly modern, but the impression I get is that the idea of making
kvass from bread is sort of the "bathtub gin" method. Also, in spite of
the fact that some people do use toasted rye bread today, it could be a
misunderstanding of the mashing process described in the more detailed
recipes.

The recipe I use calls for ground barley malt to be mixed with rye flour
and water to make a thick porridge or dough. This gets heated in an
extremely low oven for eight to twelve hours, which will give the
outside of the loaf a crust of sorts, but will not really cook the
middle. This allows the malt and the rye to mash, since the internal
temperature never gets above 150∞F or so. This loaf is then crumbled and
dissolved in water. Meanwhile some more water is boiled, to which cane
sugar, dried mint, and a chile pepper or two are added. You combine
these two  mixtures, and when the temperature has reached an appropriate
level, you add your yeast and ferment the whole thing without straining.
A primary fermenter, such as is used with English ales, is helpful here,
or you'll almost certainly clog the airlock and explode!

After a week or two you rack the kvass from the copious sediment and
bottle it with two or three raisins in each bottle. Wait another ten
days to two weeks and drink through clenched teeth, like the court of
Richard II is rumored to have done. If you actually wait a couple of
months, it will become reasonably clear and rather like a pretty good
small ale. Final gravity should be quite low, so it is quite refreshing
on a hot day, if a bit on the potent side. Kind of like Budweiser
without the rice (blechh!), which, if they wouldn't insist on calling it
beer, wouldn't be too bad.

If anybody actually feels they need more details than this, I'll try to
find the recipe. Don't all speak at once!

> Stefan li Rous

Adamantius

From: Philip E Cutone <flip+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:40:31 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass

Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> writes:
> Mark Harris wrote:
> > I have heard a little about this drink but not since it was last discussed
....
> It is fairly modern, 

On this, i must object!  In my copy of "Domestroi", which originally
was written in 17th cent (I think... perhaps early 18th) kvass is
talked about. (and I believe a description for making it was given as
well) Ok, not period, but not "modern" :)  (you may have been refering
to the recipe, rather than the drink, in which case, I apologize.)

Modern day Kvass is more like Period Ginger ale or root beer, according
to some friends from Ukraine and russia.  They say it comes in big
tanker trucks you go up to (supplying your own cup) and pay for a
fill.  Kids, adults, etc all drink it, which leads me to believe the
alcohol content is minimal. They say it's best when it's "fresh" (a
couple days old) which also leads me to believe it's more like a soft drink.

My attempt at making it produced a very strong drink which wasn't all
that bad... of course, i made it without knowledge of any proportions
etc, so the finished product knocked my Ukranian friend in the
proverbial... well, never mind.   Lets just say it was more like kvass
wine, rather than root beer.

It involved some rye bread, honey, sugar, mint, rasins, and a couple
other things i forget... (ok... so i brew like i cook... ;)  My
version was also aged, which meant it was more like a mead/wine.

I believe the domestroi version calls for honey, which would make the
drink more like a weak braggot...

I'll look up my references if there is interest.

In Service to the People of the Society,
Filip of the Marche

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 16:50:32 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass

Philip E Cutone wrote in response to me: 
> Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> writes:
> > It is fairly modern,
> 
> On this, i must object!  In my copy of "Domestroi", which originally
> was written in 17th cent ( i think... perhaps early 18th) kvass is
> talked about. (and i believe a description for making it was given as
> well) Ok, not period, but not "modern" :)  (you may have been refering
> to the recipe, rather than the drink, in which case, i apologize.)

Yes, the recipe I used probably dates from the late 19th, early 20th
century. Specific quantities were given on things like malt, sugar,
etc., so I think that the level of alcohol I ended up with was what the
original author intended. What I got, as I say, was along the lines of a
small ale, roughly 2 - 3% alcohol. 
> 
> Modern day Kvass is more like Period Ginger ale or root beer, according
> to some friends from Ukraine and russia.  They say it comes in big
> tanker trucks you go up to (supplying your own cup) and pay for a
> fill.  Kids, adults, etc all drink it, which leads me to believe the
> alcohol content is minimal. They say it's best when it's "fresh" (a
> couple days old) which also leads me to believe it's more like a soft drink.

My recipe also says you should drink it pretty quickly. I found that it
was OK after being in the bottle about 4 days, and deteriorated after
that, and then got interesting again after two or three months.

Adamantius

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 18:35:27 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - kvas

Mark Harris wrote:
> >A primary fermenter, such as is used with English ales, is helpful here,
> >or you'll almost certainly clog the airlock and explode!
> 
> What is a “primary fermenter”? I’ve made mead but not beer or ale.

A primary fermenter is usually a sort of bucket with a snap-on top. Some
modern English recipes call for doing the first fermentation, which
produces a lot of gunky foam which generally dries to the consistency of
concrete, in such a fermenter, often topped with some kind of plastic
wrap, before going to the standard secondary fermenter, which is usually
a glass carboy with a water-filled airlock fitted to it. If you don't
watch it carefully, and do a primary fermentation in a carboy, there's a
chance the airlock will get clogged with dried foam, and some sort of
explosion might result. For our batch of kvass we used a wide-mouthed
glass demijohn, formerly used for making wine. It has a snap-on top with
a pinhole punched in it, to relieve excess gas pressure. Had there been
any problems with clogging, the top just lifts off, and you can go in
with something like a stainless-steel spoon to remove the crud.

Adamantius

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
To: Mark Harris, Uduido at aol.com
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:33:25 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass

Here's the kvass recipe, which is clearly modern. It may be describing
some variant on an older process, but I hjave no way of knowing the date
of the recipe quoted in Andre L. Simon's "A Concise Encyclopedia of
Gastronomy",  pub. Harcourt, Brace, 1952, reprinted 1981, Overlook
Press, Woodstock, NY. This is from the section on wines (there are beer
references and cocktail references too), and attributed to a source
"R.C.B." Who or what that may be is not clear. Royal College of Butlers?
Bartenders? Rollo Charmondelay Blitherington?

"KVASS

A very refreshing Russian beverage which is made in many Russian
households about once a week.

'With eight quarts water take 1 1/2 lb. malt, 1 lb. rye flour, 1 1/2 lb.
sugar, 1/8 of a lb. mint leaves, half pepper pod, and half cake of
yeast. Mix the malt and flour with boiling water and make a thick dough.
Put into barely warm oven, and leave for the night. Next day dilute
dough with eight quarts boiling water and pour into a wooden tub. Let
stand for 12 hours, then pass through a cloth. Pour one quart into an
enamel saucepan, put on fire, add 1 1/2 lb. sugar, and an infusion made
with the mint leaves (resembling weak tea). Boil once, then take off
fire, cool until just warm, and add the yeast previously diluted with
one cup of this same warm liquid. Let stand in warm place until it
begins to ferment; then pour it into the rest of the kvass in the wooden
tub, and let stand until bubbles appear. Prepare clean bottles, putting
one malaga raisin into each; pour in the kvass, cork the bottles, tie
the corks with string to the necks of the bottles, and keep in a warm
place for a day or two. Then put in a cold cellar.' --- R.C.B."

As I've mentioned, I have made kvass using this recipe and it wasn't
bad, although it was best either when just a few days old, and then
again when about three months old. I believe the quarts mentioned are
Imperial quarts (roughly 38 1/2 ounces), which wouldn't matter except
that not all the measuring units are quarts volume.

I haven't posted this to the list, simply because it seems we are
getting away from the food topic on this one. Please feel free to
forward this to the list if you feel strongly that it belongs there.

Adamantius

From: Philip E Cutone <flip+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 11:55:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: SC - Domostroi/Kvass Farily long

It seems i may have been incorrect about the domostroi being just out
of period:
http://www3.traveller.com/chess/trivia/r.html has:
>In 1549 the Protohierarch Sylvester wrote his Domostroi (Houshold Government).

and from http://coral.bucknell.edu/departments/russian/chrono1.html:
>1560's          Edition of Domostroi, a book of principles of family life

so it seems that it is at least 40 ish years in period.

here is the bib info from rialto clothing archive:
    The Domostroi
    Carolyn Johnston Pouncy
    Cornell University Press, Ithaca 1994
    0-8014-2410-0
    culture, Russian
    Rules for Russian households in the time
    of Ivan the Terrible
    (essentially the Medieval Home Companion for Russia) 

The domestroi is a pretty cool book.  It's fairly sexist, but then,
that was the norm then.  If you dig through, you can find quite a few
recipies and menu's for various tiimes of year.

(from what i remember from the translated version) 
To make Ordinary Kvass:
you add one part honey to five parts water and a soft rye loaf. let
sit a while, strain and bottle up.

When i remember to bring it in, i'll type in the translated sections. 

here are other reverences i've found online:

Travelers yellow pages online http://www.infoservices.com/stpete/94.htm
has this to say about it:
>Kvas is a traditional lightly fermented drink made from rye bread and
>raisins, once sold from tank trailers on every street corner. Now two
>beverage manufacturers," Polyustrovo" and "Bavariya", have begun to
>bottle kvas in 0.33 l bottles, while another beverage factory
>n.a. Razin, also produces kvas on draught.  

http://hubris.engin.umich.edu:8080/Beer/Threads/Threads/thread.829083082.html#71:
> As several persons have noted, kvass is made from rye,
>while kumys or kumiss is made from fermented mare's milk.  John
>Braue, though, is incorrect in suggesting in HBD #1913 that the
>making kvass from rye bread is a prison varient.  It's actually
>the most common way to make kvass: soak dry, toasted rye bread in
>water with sugar and lemon (if possible), let ferment slightly
>and drink while still fermenting.  I've also had it made from rye
>flour.  Prepared properly, it's tart, effervesent, and quite
>refreshing, especially after a hard morning spent planting
>potatoes.  It's the base of several traditional Russian soups.
>        Commercially-prepared kvass was considerably sweeter,
>rather insipid, and almost flat.  It was traditionally served
>direct from large tanker trailers.  The saleswoman had three
>mugs, usually, which she would take back from customers and rinse
>in a pail of filthy water before serving her next customer. 
>Before perestroika, this was the most common way of selling beer
>as well, though by 1990 these mugs were in short supply, and beer
>drinkers generally brought their own containers.  I well remember
>standing with a couple of strangers draining a three-liter jar of
>beer outside a kiosk in Moscow in early '91.
>        Alas, kvass production is now down something like 98% in
>Russia: Russians prefer western soft drinks.
>

http://hubris.engin.umich.edu:8080/Beer/Threads/Threads/thread.825014283.html#64
is the intro to the above, but gives little information

http://hubris.engin.umich.edu:8080/Beer/Threads/Threads/thread.832942925.html
mentions that kvass contains a lactic fermentation as well.  It almost
surely did in period.. :)

http://hubris.engin.umich.edu:8080/Beer/Threads/Threads/thread.832884837.html#34:
>
>Posting 34: Extracted from file:  1914
>Date: Mon, 18 Dec 1995 13:53:59 -0800 (PST)
>From: eurquhar at sfu.ca (eric urquhart)
>Subject: kwass
>
>I found this recipe on my hardrive from an old HBD.
>
>Subject: Kvass/Kwass
>From: duncan at vt.edu
>Date: Mon, 10 Jan 94 10:35:28 -0500
>
>Sounds like an interesting experiment - was the product drinkable at all?
>
>For the sake of comparison, here's a recipe for "Kwass" taken from "The
>Compleat Anachronist Guide to Brewing" (Compleat Anachronist #6),
>published by the Society for Creative Anachronism:
> ---------begin quote-----------
>Kwass
>(Yield: 6 cups)
>1 lb. day-old black bread or Danish pumpernickel
>1 cup sugar
>2 tbsp. dry yeast
>1/4 cup lukewarm water
>2 tbsp. mint leaves or 1 tbsp. dry mint
>2 tbsp. raisins
>
>Dry the bread and then chop it into coarse pieces. The add the bread to six
>quarts of boiling water, remove from heat and cover with a towel. Set aside
>for eight hours. Then strain the mixture through a fine sieve into another
>large pot, extracting as much liquid from the bread as possible. Discard the
>bread. Add the yeast and 1/4 tsp. sugar to the lukewarm (110-115 F [43-46 C])
>water and stir thoroughly. Set this aside for about ten minutes in a warm
>place and then add the yeast mixture, the remaining sugar, and the mint [to
>the 6 quarts of bread-water], cover again with a towel, and set aside for
>about another 8 hours. Strain the mixture again and bottle in a gallon jug
>or several quart-size bottles. Fill the bottles 2/3 full, then divide the
>raisins evenly among the bottles. Cover each bottle with plastic wrap
>secured with a rubber band. Place in a cool spot for three to five days, or
>until the raisins rise to the top and the sediment sinks to the bottom.
>Carefully decant the clear amber liquid [picking out the raisins?] and
>rebottle in clean bottles. Refrigerate until ready to drink.
> ----------end quote--------------
>Sounds interesting, although I've never tried it. "Dry yeast"? I suppose
>bread yeast (yech!) would suffice, but I'd use ale yeast in my own typical
>overkill manner. Evidently, this version is not meant to be served
>carbonated, but in a second recipe the author directs you to bottle the
>mixture as soon as you see gas bubbles rising from the fermentation (of
>course, he also complains of the bottles building up so much pressure that
>the corks were extruded throught the wire cage - can you say "kwass
>grenades"? I knew you could). Further recipes on the making of Kumiss
>(fermented milk) <shudder> and Kefir (fermented buttermilk - which I have
>tried to make and do not recommend for the weak of stomach). Basic beer,
>mead and winemaking information is also included.
>
>The CA Guide to Brewing, Compleat Anachronist series #6 is available
>for $3.00 from:
>Society for Creative Anachronism
>Stock Clerk
>P.O. Box 360743
>Milpitas, CA  95035-0743  USA
>
>Regards, and happy brewing!
>Tom Brady
>(known occasionally as Lord Duncan MacKinnon of Tobermory)
>duncan at vt.edu
>
>Eric Urquhart, Centre for Pest Management,
>Department of Biological Sciences, Simon Fraser University,
>Burnaby B.C. CANADA V5A 1S6
>e-mail: eurquhar at sfu.ca

there is also a goodly amount of discussion in the rialto archives:
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/rialto/kvass-msg.html

which provides some references...

Cat's meow has a recipe for mint kvass at
http://alpha.rollanet.org/cm3/recs/12_47.html:
>
>Mint Kvas
>
>Classification: kvass, rye, bread, mint kvass
>
>Source: Dave Vaness (vaness at bowler.dacc.wisc.edu), r.c.b., September
>22, 1995
>
>The following quotation and recipe are from "Russia" of the Time-Life
>Foods of the World series.
>
>"For drink the peasant diet had kvas, which was much like the 'small
>beer' of Western Europe. It could be made from grain and malt, but was
>often made from leftover dark bread soaked in hot water and allowed to
>ferment for a few hours; sugar, fruit or honey was customarily added
>as a sweetener. The finished brew could be drunk on the spot or
>bottled for later use; in some households a part of the brew served as
>a fermented stock for soups. Homemade kvas is somewhat effervescent
>and only slightly alcoholic. It has never enchanted many non-Russians,
>but it had an important place in the peasant diet. It was cheap and
>the yeast suspended in it, like the vegetables in shchi [cabbage soup]
>or borshch (beet soup), formed a nutricious supplement to a limited
>diet."
>
>Ingredients: (for 6 cups)
>
>       1 pound day-old black bread or Danish pumpernickel
>       2 tablespoons active dry yeast
>       1 cup sugar
>       1/4 cup lukewarm water (110 - 115F)1/4 cup lukewarm water (110
>- 115F)
>       2 tablespoons fresh mint leaves or 1 tablespoon crumbled dried
>mint
>       2 tablespoons raisins
>
>Procedure:
>
>Preheat the oven to 200F. Place the bread in the oven for about 1
>hour, or until it is thoroughly dry. With a heavy knife, cut and chop
>it coarsely. Bring 6 quarts of water to a boil in an 8-quart casserole
>and drop in the bread. Remove from heat, cover loosely with a kitchen
>towel, and set it aside for at least 8 hours.  Strain the contents of
>the casserole through a fine sieve set over another large pot or bowl,
>pressing down hard on the soaked bread with the back of a large spoon
>before discarding it.
>
>Sprinkle the yeast and 1/4 teaspoon of the sugar over the 1/4 cup of
>lukewarm water and stir to dissolve the yeast completely. Set aside in
>a warm, draft-free spot (such as an unlighted oven) for about 10
>minutes, or until the mixture almost doubles in volume. Stir the yeast
>mixture, the remaining sugar and the mint into the strained bread
>water, cover with a towel, and set aside for at least 8 hours.
>
>Strain the mixture again through a fine sieve set over a large bowl or
>casserole, then prepare to bottle it.  You will need 2 - 3 quart-sized
>bottles, or a gallon jug. Pour the liquid through a funnel 2/3 of the
>way up the sides of the bottle. Then divide the raisins among the
>bottles and cover the top of each bottle with plastic wrap, secured
>with a rubber band. Place in a cool -- but not cold -- spot for 3 - 5
>days, or until the raisins have risen to the top and the sediment has
>sunk to the bottom. Carefully pour off the clear amber liquid and
>re-bottle it in the washed bottles. Refrigerate until ready to
>use. Although Russians drink kvas as a cold beverage, it may also be
>used as a cold-soup stock in okroshka (chilled vegetable soup with
>meat) or botvinia (green vegetable soup with fish).

I love the net... ;)

In Service to the People of the Society,
Filip of the Marche

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:33:25 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
To: Uduido at aol.com, mark_harris at quickmail
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass

Here's the kvass recipe, which is clearly modern. It may be describing
some variant on an older process, but I hjave no way of knowing the date
of the recipe quoted in Andre L. Simon's "A Concise Encyclopedia of
Gastronomy",  pub. Harcourt, Brace, 1952, reprinted 1981, Overlook
Press, Woodstock, NY. This is from the section on wines (there are beer
references and cocktail references too), and attributed to a source
"R.C.B." Who or what that may be is not clear. Royal College of Butlers?
Bartenders? Rollo Charmondelay Blitherington?

"KVASS

A very refreshing Russian beverage which is made in many Russian
households about once a week.

'With eight quarts water take 1 1/2 lb. malt, 1 lb. rye flour, 1 1/2 lb.
sugar, 1/8 of a lb. mint leaves, half pepper pod, and half cake of
yeast. Mix the malt and flour with boiling water and make a thick dough.
Put into barely warm oven, and leave for the night. Next day dilute
dough with eight quarts boiling water and pour into a wooden tub. Let
stand for 12 hours, then pass through a cloth. Pour one quart into an
enamel saucepan, put on fire, add 1 1/2 lb. sugar, and an infusion made
with the mint leaves (resembling weak tea). Boil once, then take off
fire, cool until just warm, and add the yeast previously diluted with
one cup of this same warm liquid. Let stand in warm place until it
begins to ferment; then pour it into the rest of the kvass in the wooden
tub, and let stand until bubbles appear. Prepare clean bottles, putting
one malaga raisin into each; pour in the kvass, cork the bottles, tie
the corks with string to the necks of the bottles, and keep in a warm
place for a day or two. Then put in a cold cellar.' --- R.C.B."

As I've mentioned, I have made kvass using this recipe and it wasn't
bad, although it was best either when just a few days old, and then
again when about three months old. I believe the quarts mentioned are
Imperial quarts (roughly 38 1/2 ounces), which wouldn't matter except
that not all the measuring units are quarts volume.

I haven't posted this to the list, simply because it seems we are
getting away from the food topic on this one. Please feel free to
forward this to the list if you feel strongly that it belongs there.

Adamantius

Subject: kvas (from Stephanie Dale)
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 98 16:52:27 MST
From: Stephen Dale <sdale at mail.tqci.net>
To: "Mark.S Harris" <rsve60 at msgphx1>

I just found this nifty little book that has period recipes from Russia.
By Leslie Chamberlain, it's called _The_Food_and_Cooking_of_Russia. Not
all the recipes are period, however. I posted info about period noodles
from it on Rialto today. Chamberlaine says that kvas was the national
drink from the 1500's. She gives a recipe that she claims is similar to
hard cider, and she makes it herself.

                1 tbsp dried yeast
                5 0z malt extract
                12 oz rye flour
                3 1/2 oz buckwheat flour
                3 1/2 oz wheat flour
                4 1/4 pts water
                1/2 tbsp dried mint

Add yeast and one tbsp of flour to 1/4 c. warm water. Mix the flours
together. Dilute the malt in some hot water, then add to the flour with
two pints of the water above. Stir well, getting out all the lumps.
Allow to stand 5 hours. Then blend in the rest of the water, the yeast
and the mint. Allow to ferment for twelve to twenty-four hours then
strain and bottle. She suggests that the corks be put on loosely, and
that the brew be served chilled.

Aislinn Columba of Carlisle
aka Nadya Petrovna Stoianova

Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 17:53:36 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass.

Michael F. Gunter wrote:
> Um. I don't have the recipe on hand right now. Does anybody else have this
> recipe handy?
>
> Gunthar

>From Andre L. Simon's "A Concise Encyclopedia of Gastronomy", Harcourt,
Brace, New York, 1952, the section on wines and other beverages:

"KVASS
A very refreshing Russian beverage which is made in many Russian
households about once a week.

'With eight quarts water take 1 1/2 lb. malt, 1 lb. rye flour, 1 1/2 lb.
sugar, 1/8 of a lb. mint leaves, half pepp-er pod, and half cake of
yeast. Mix the malt and flour with boiling water and make a thick dough.
Put into barely warm oven, and leave for the night.Next day dilute dough
with eight quarts boiling water and pour into a wooden tub. Let stand
for 12 hours, then pass through a cloth. Pour one quart into an enamel
saucepan, put on fire, add 1 1/2 lb. sugar and an infusion made wioth
the mint leaves (resembling weak tea). Boil once, then take off fire,
cool until just warm, and add the yeast previously diluted with one cup
of this same warm liquid. Let stand in warm place until it begins to
ferment; then pour into the rest of the kvass in the wooden tub, and let
stand until bubbles appear. Prepare clean bottles, putting one malaga
raisin into each; pour in the kvass, cork the bottles, tie the corks
with string to the necks of the bottles, and keep in a warm place for a
day or two. Then put in a cold cellar.' -- R.C.B"

Note that the initials R.C.B., in keeping with the style for attribution
and documentation used elsewhere in the book, should be included in the
source key at the end of the book, but aren't, unless there is a
typographical error. I couldn't even begin to guess at the date, apart
from saying it resembles, stylistically, English recipes anywhere from
the mid-to-late 19th century, possibly as recent as the 1930's or 40's.

I've made this stuff, and it's better than it sounds. Kinda like a small
wheat beer with mint instead of hops. In spite of what the recipe says,
I found it at its best at around two weeks of age. Much more aging than
that would be a problem given its low gravity. Lacking an oven that
would maintain a low enough temperature to mash the mixture without
killing the enzymes in the malt (below 158 degrees F.), I put my dough
into a crockpot on the lowest setting, stirring frequently. I also used
a brewers's yeast, probably Munton and Fisson's Ale Yeast.

Oh, and don't be alarmed by the fact that the raisins will more or less
turn back into grapes and become completely spherical!

Adamantius

Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:03:36 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass.

Varju at aol.com wrote:
> A little bit of trivia. . .when I was taking Russian in college my professor
> said that when he was in Russia Kvass was made from rye bread, malt and yeast
> and mint and was often used as a hangover remedy. . .
>
> Noemi

I'd often heard of kvass being made from rye bread, but never actually
seen a recipe in English except the one I posted. I have seen one other,
apparently in Russian, but, oddly enough, in the Roman alphabet. Polish
perhaps?

I'd just assumed that the idea it was made from bread was a distorted
description of the process of forming the mash into loaves and putting
it in a warm oven.

However, a friend of mine, a former NCO in the USCG, spoke to the cook
on board a Russian frieighter, and he was told that making it from bread
was sort of the cheater's way to do it, but actually much more common.
They were actually drinking kvass on board the ship at the time, with
their lunch...

Adamantius

Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 18:27:58 EDT
From: melc2newton at juno.com
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass.

On Wed, 15 Jul 1998 17:53:36 -0400 Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
writes:

>>From Andre L. Simon's "A Concise Encyclopedia of Gastronomy",
>Harcourt,
>Brace, New York, 1952, the section on wines and other beverages:
>
>"KVASS
>A very refreshing Russian beverage which is made in many Russian
>households about once a week.
<recipe snipped>
>
>Note that the initials R.C.B., in keeping with the style for attribution
>and documentation used elsewhere in the book, should be included in the
>source key at the end of the book, but aren't, unless there is a
>typographical error. I couldn't even begin to guess at the date, apart
>from saying it resembles, stylistically, English recipes anywhere from
>the mid-to-late 19th century, possibly as recent as the 1930's or
>40's.

Here is some documentable stuff on Kvass from the Domostroi, which is a
household rulebook from 16th C. Muscovy:

In chapter 29:  Similarly, she (the wife) should know how they (the
servants) make beer, mead, vodka, weak beer, kvass, vinegar, and sour
cabbage - every liquid normally used in cooking and breadmaking.

In chapter 36: A women should drink either weak beer or kvass, both at
home and in public.

In chapter 42: In a well-ordered home you can find (animal) feed in
either summer or winter: dregs of beer, vinegar, kvass, and sour cabbage
soup.....

In chapter 52: The steward should measure and record amounts of bread,
rolls, beers, vodka, ale, kvass, sour cabbage, vinegar, siftings, bran,
dregs of any kind, yeast, and hops.

In chapter 54: (titled How to Preserve Food in the Cellar and the
Icehouse)
There you should also store cucumbers, pickled and fresh cabbage,
turnips, other vegetables. . . apple kvass, bilberry juice, Rhenish wine,
vodka, mead, fermented and unfermented beer, and ale.

In chapter 65: Ordinary kvass. To brew ordinary kvass, Take four parts
honey and strain it until it is clear. Put it in a jar and ferment it
using an ordinary soft loaf, without additional yeast. When it is done,
pour it into a cask.

In chapter 67: (wedding rituals) {setting up the groom's and bride's
room} A sideboard stands nearby, holding a dozen mugs containing
different drinks made from mead and kvass.

Little bits and pieces, I know, but the book was handy (i.e. I knew where
it was) and decided to share. BTW, the Domostroi I have is edited and
translated by Carolyn Johnston Pouncy, published by Cornell University
1994 ISBN 0-8014-2410-0

beatrix

Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:57:47 -0400
From: "Harold Tackett" <htackett at eagnet.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Kvass.

Your comments hit something's in my memory, I thought that I had seen a
recipe in one of my cookbooks. I found it. From "A Taste of Russia, A
Cookbook of Russian Hospitality" by Darra Goldstein, ISBN 006973854.

Black Bread Kvass
1 1/2 pounds stale black bread, cubed
1 1/2 tbs. dried mint
1 small lemon, cut into chunks
10 cups boiling water
1/2 cup sugar
1 tsp. cream of tartar
1 package active dry yeast
8 grains of white rice

Place the bread cubes on a baking sheet and toast in a 325 degrees oven for
about 20  minutes, or until dry. Transfer to a large crock. Sprinkle the
mint over the toasted cubes. Add the lemon. Pour the boiling water over
all, and cover the crock tightly. Let stand 5 to 6 hours.
Strain the liquid through cheesecloth, pressing down on the bread with the
back of a spoon in order to extract as much liquid as possible, but with
out pushing sediment through. To the liquid add the sugar, the cream of
tartar and the yeast, which has been dissolved in a little of the liquid.
Stir well to mix. Cover the container, let stand undisturbed for 8 hours.
The next day, strain once more through cheesecloth and pour into a 1-quart
bottle. Add the 8 grains of rice. Seal. Let stand for 8 hours more at room
temperature. Then strain once more through cheesecloth into a clean bottle
and refrigerate until ready to use.   Yield : I quart

Dinah bint Ismai'l

Subject: Kvass recipes
Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 11:08:19 -0400
From: "Stephen and Stephanie Dale" <sdale at mx00.us.hsanet.net>
To: <stefan at texas.net>

Some history about kvas from _The Art of Russian Cooking_ by Nina
Nicolaieff.

Distilled liquor beverages came to Russia fairly late, for they learned the
art of distilling from the Genovese living in the Crimea in the 14th century.
Before that time, going back to the Kievan period, the drinks of chioce were
kvass and med (mead). Both are noted in an early 5th century account of a
Byzantine envoy who was going to visit Atilla the Hun. Mead came to Kievan
Russia from the Vikings. Documents exist that show St. Vladimir ordering 300
kettles of mead for a new church opening, and that a prince in the 1100's
had 500 casks of mead in his cellar. At funerals the Russians drank a
combination of mead, beer, wine and rum, called Trisna, which was passed
around and used to toast the departed. Kvass is documented back to AD 100.

The recipes come from _Folk Wines, Cordials and Brandies_ by M.A. Jagendorf.

Slavic Bread Wine
1-2 gal water
2 lemons
raisins
spices (different kinds, but not too much)
1-2 lbs sugar for each gallon of water
2 -3 lbs black bread for each gallon of water

Put the water in an enamel pot. Add the peels (zest) and juice of the
lemons. Cut up the raisin and add those. Put the spices (cloves, coriander,
caraway, a few peppercorn, and any others you favor) into alittle cloth bag
and put into the pot. Bring to the boil. Add sugar. Slice bread and toast
it, being careful not to burn it. Or you can use stale, hard bread. Pour the
hot water over the bread in a crock. Cover the crock and set it in a warm
place. If you have used good black bread, it will start fermenting very
quickly. Stir it with a wooden spoon daily. When it has ceased fermenting,
let it rest for a few days to let the bread settle. Then siphon it off and
clear it.

It is best to but the wine into strong bottles and cork it and wire the
corks on. You may get a powerful, bubbling champagne , which will force out
any ordinary cork or even explode the bottle.
Bread wine matures quickly, but it is best to let it rest for a year.

Kwass

The author mentions that the kwass in Bukowina, Austria, was made with
apples. Small whole apples were put in the water before boiling it, and then
put into each glass of kvass as it was served. He has modified this recipe a
bit from the original, which was made in a monastery in NY state and was
very sour. The original contained no raisins and very little honey.

3 lbs stale, well-baked rye bread
5 gal water
3 lbs. raisins
2 lbs honey
2 packages yeast (he uses baker's yeast)
1 tbsp. whole wheat flour

Cut the bread into small pieces and put then into a crock or barrel. Boil
the water and pour it over the bread. Add the raisins, cut up. Cover the
crock with a cloth and let liquid stand until it cools. Filter through a
napkin or cloth, but do not squeeze it. Add the honey to the liquid, and mix
thoroughly. Dissolve the yeast in 1/2 cup warm water. Pour it in and add the
flour.

Cover and place in a warm room (65 -70 degrees). Let the must stand until it
starts fermenting, then filter it. Pour it into bottles, adding two raisins
to each bottle. After a few days, it should be good to drink. Alcohol
content is around 6%.

I will read the kumiss file too and see if I can add anything to it. The
time-life book of Russian cooking has a couple of pages of history of kumiss
which also descibes how it is made out on the steppes.

BTW, the author of the cookbook also has a recipe for Kvass almost exactly
like Jagendorf's. She suggests putting the bottles immediately in the
refrigerator to keep them from bursting.

Aislinn

Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 02:16:34 -0500
From: "Chris and Trish Makowski" <roecourt at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Russian embassy meal

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
>Jenn/Yana wrote:
>> >No time to let it get bubbly, and I can't find any of the concentrate
>> >around here that would be ready in time.
>
>Um, what concentrate would that be? I've seen kvass made from malt and
>cane sugar, bread and cane sugar, honey, but concentration was never
>really part of things, especially after drinking kvass...would you mind
>perhaps sharing a recipe and explaining about the concentrates involved?

It's a concentrate avaliable commercially in stores that cater to the
Russian emigree community.  It's made in Russia, therefore the can is
labelled such. Translated to  western script it's basically:

Kontsyentrat kvasnogo soosla

Directions for reconstituting: for 1 qt, dilute 2 tablespoons of concentrate
into 1 qt warm water (100-110 F) add 1/3 cup sugar, 1/4 of a yeast  cake,
and cover top with cheesecloth. keep in warm place (90-95 F) for 18-20
hours. Is ready when it becomes transparent and tickles the tongue. Cover
tightly, cool, and keep refridgerated.

For Adamanitus and other Yankees:
Is probably avaliable in NY at Fish Town on Brighton Beach Ave, and at Gold
Star Smoked Fish on Smith Street as both these shops cater  to the emigree
community. Also Shop and Save in Trenton NJ.

Anya

Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:33:05 -0600
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: SC - Fw: [TY] recipe question

>I am looking for a recipe, modern or period, that involves fermenting
>fruit.  The recipe I used to have had something to do with various types
>of canned fruit, that was added with sugar over several days.   When the
>fruit was used, more was to be dumped into the container.  If this sounds
>familiar, please send me your recipe.
>
>I also want to find out how far back this type of fruit compote dates.
>Are there any period references to fermenting fresh fruit in this way?
>
>Melandra of the Woods

I haven't found any solid period references, but a similar process is used
to make kvas in Russia.  Kvas is a beverage rather than something you would
eat with a spoon.  Curiously, the Russian <kompot> is a beverage made from
soaked and mashed fruits.  "Moscow kvas" may be similar to what is known as
<mors> in the "Domostroi" (16th cen Russian household book).  This recipe
is translated by Liudmila from the Slavic Interest Group and is from a
Russian cookbook, early 20th century.  It doesn't end up very alcoholic at all.

**************************************
Moskow kvas can be made out of pretty much any fruits and berries, such as
apples, raspberries, red currants, cherries, mountain ash berries (riabina),
strawberies, or pears.  Strawberries and raspberries require small wooden
barrels and a somewhat complicated procedure -- ask me later if you want.
The rest can be made in large glass jars. Fill out your jar completely with
fruit or berries (uncut, I think) and add cold boiled water to fill.  Place
the jar in a cold place and wait about three days, when you can drink it with
sugar added right in the glass if you want.  Apple and red currant kvas are
good with lemon rind in the jar.  Note that one jar lends lots of kvas sinse
you are supposed to refill it with cold boiled water as long as there is
flavor left.  It is essential that the berries and the fruit be absolutely
unblemished since any damage may result in fermentation.

Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 22:02:03 -0500
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: SC - Kvas

>>>All of this kind of reminds me of a trip I took to Russia some years back. While there, especially in Moscow, there were drink machines at various locations, which dispensed glasses of kvass, which, if memory serves, was a lightly fizzy, probably light in the alcohol department and very tasty.  Is kvass period?  If so, (or even if not) can it be made easily and does anyone have a recipe?
Kiri  <<<

Yes, kvas is period.  As Stephen posted, you can find some more info in the
Florilegium.  And your recollection is correct, kvas is lightly fizzy and
has a little bit alcohol in it (although native Russians will swear on
their mother's grave that it has no alcohol whatsoever).  There are no
period recipes, but there are mentions of different types of kvas in the
Domostroi (16th cen) and other SCA-period Russian sources.  I use a modern
kvas concentrate to make mine, but only because I don't like the taste of
kvas (sorry) and I don't want to make huge quantities of it.  I am sure the
real way is better, but even the Russian cookbooks say to use the
concentrate.  This summer I will try to make real kvas and I'll let people
know how it goes.  I would also like to invite you (and anyone else who is
interested) to come to the Slavic and Eastern European Party at Pennsic and
try some kvas.  I made a gallon last War and it went over very well, so
I'll probably make more this year, maybe even the Real Stuff (TM).  Various
modern recipes follow.

- --Yana

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05
 
      Title Kvas
 Categories Kazakh, Soup, Ethnic, Russian, Sidedish
      Yield 6 Servings
 
      1 lb Stale black bread
           - or -
      1 lb Pumpernickel bread, stale
      1 c  Sugar
      2 tb Raisins
      2 tb Mint leaves, fresh
           - or -
      1 tb Dried mint leaves
      2 tb Active dry yeast
    1/4 c  Luke warm water
 
**NOTE** Water must [not?] be hot as it will kill the yeast. Oven must be
preheated to 200 degrees F. Cube bread then spread on a cookie sheet and
place in oven for 1 hour. Bring 6 quarts of water to a boil and drop in the
bread.. Remove from heat, cover with a towel, & allow to sit at room
temperature for 8 hours. Strain through a fine seive by pressing the
moistuire from the bread. Sprinkle the yeast & 1/4 teaspoon of sugar over
the cup of lukewarm water and stir to dissolve the yeast completely. Set
aside in a warm place covered by a towel for approx. 10-12 minutes or
until. mixture doubles in volume. Add the mint leaves, and remaining sugar,
stir well then re-cover with the towel and set aside for 8-12 hours more at
room temperature.

Again strain the mixture through a fine seive. Pour into a 1 gal.
container, add the raisins, cover the top with plastic wrap, secure with a
rubber band, and place in cool NOT cold, spot for 4-5 days or until the
raisins are floating and the sediment has sunk to the bottom. Pour off the
clear amber liquid and rebottle in a clean jug or bottles. refrigerate
until ready to use. In Russia this is a beverage as well as cold soup stock.

ORIGIN Dr. Sergei Betschonov, Uralsk-Kazakhstan, circa  1995
From Dr. Donald Houston
 
MMMMM

From the Russian cookbook of the Time-Life series

Ingredients: (for 6 cups)
1 pound dayold black bread or Danish pumpernickel
2 tablespoons active dry yeast
1 cup sugar
1/4 cup lukewarm water (110  115F)1/4 cup lukewarm water (110  115F)
2 tablespoons fresh mint leaves or 1 tablespoon crumbled dried mint
2 tablespoons raisins

Procedure:
Preheat the oven to 200F. Place the bread in the oven for about 1 hour, or
until it is thoroughly dry. With a heavy knife, cut and chop it coarsely.
Bring 6 quarts of water to a boil in an 8-quart casserole and drop in the
bread. Remove from heat, cover loosely with a kitchen towel, and set it
aside for at least 8 hours. Strain the contents of the casserole through a
fine sieve set over another large pot or bowl, pressing down hard on the
soaked bread with the back of a large spoon before discarding it.

Sprinkle the yeast and 1/4 teaspoon of the sugar over the 1/4 cup of
lukewarm water and stir to dissolve the yeast completely. Set aside in a
warm, draftfree spot (such as an unlighted oven) for about 10 minutes, or
until the mixture almost doubles in volume. Stir the yeast mixture, the
remaining sugar and the mint into the strained bread water, cover with a
towel, and set aside for at least 8 hours

Also, here is a recipe [from a modern Russian cookbook] for "Peter the
Great's kvas" -- a recipe that is claimed to have originated around Peter's
time:

This recipe is for 5 liters of kvas.  Slice some rye bread thinly and dry the 
slices in your oven till they are brown.  You will need 800 grams of these 
"sukhari."  Cover them with 4 liters of boiling water and leave for 2 hours.  
Strain the liquid.  Then, add 20-25 grams of yeast and sugar to taste (500 
grams suggested).  The resulting kvas needs to ferment for 5 to 6 hours.  
When it is ready, add 100 grams of grated horseradish mixed with 100 grams of 
honey.  If desired, spices and dried mint can be added to taste.  The kvas 
has to be kept refrigerated.

[also modern] "Moskow kvas" can be made out of pretty much any fruits and
berries, such as apples, raspberries, red currants, cherries, mountain ash
berries (riabina), strawberies, or pears.  Strawberries and raspberries
require small wooden barrels and a somewhat complicated procedure [which my
source did not include] Fill out your jar completely with fruit or berries
(uncut, I think) and add cold boiled water to fill.  Place the jar in a
cold place and wait about three days, when you can drink it with sugar
added right in the glass if you want.  Apple and red currant kvas are good
with lemon rind in the jar.  Note that one jar lends lots of kvas since you
are supposed to refill it with cold boiled water as long as there is flavor
left.  It is essential that the berries and the fruit be absolutely
unblemished since any damage may result in fermentation.

Date: Sun, 04 Jun 2000 22:19:14 -0500
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: SC - RE: kvas

>Do you know of any mail order sources for this kvas concentrate?

Nope, sorry (I checked the web anyway).  The stuff I use is made by "Amros"
in Somerset, NJ; 908-846-7755.  Maybe you can call them?  When you get
some, I see that in your Florilegium you already have the translated
directions for using it under "BEVERAGES/kvass-msg.html".  :-)

- --Yana

Date: Sun, 4 Jun 2000 22:35:14 -0500
From: "Morgan Cain" <morgancain at earthlink.net>
Subject: SC - Kvas

Does the kvas-concentrate recipe use raisins to test the fermentation?  I
have one in a translated-from-Russian cookbook (starts with toasted or
dried-out black bread) that included three raisins in the ingredients.
Curious, I read on, and learned that when the bubbles are strong enough to
float them, the kvas is considered ready to drink.

   ---= Morgan

Date: Sun, 4 Jun 2000 23:54:11 EDT
From: WyteRayven at aol.com
Subject: SC - RE: kvas

Cat's Meow has several recipes listed for Kvas.  Here is the Url for them.
http://www.brewery.org/brewery/cm3/recs/12_toc.html

Ilia

Date: Mon, 05 Jun 2000 23:04:24 -0500
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: SC - Kvas

>Does the kvas-concentrate recipe use raisins to test the fermentation?  I
>have one in a translated-from-Russian cookbook (starts with toasted or
>dried-out black bread) that included three raisins in the ingredients.
>Curious, I read on, and learned that when the bubbles are strong enough to
>float them, the kvas is considered ready to drink.

Nope.  It only took overnight to get bubbly, so the raisins were not
needed.  I mixed up the kvas after dinner, set it in a warm place and let
it ferment overnight until a few hours before party-time the next evening.
We cooled it down (warning--do not stick the open gallon jug of sun-warm
kvas in a cooler full of ice water unless you want a kvas fountain) and
served it.  The native Slavs at the party said it was just like babushka
used to make.  :-)

One of the other reasons that I haven't made real kvas is that I can't seem
to find a recipe for black bread that doesn't use a darkening agent like
cocoa, molasses, or coffee. Even the modern Russian recipes call for at
least one of these ingredients.  I think we discussed this here once
before, but if anyone has any new ideas...

- --Yana

Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2000 06:55:13 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Kvas

Stefan li Rous wrote:
> If I remember correctly, the skins on grapes and raisins are a good source
> of yeasts. It may simply be that adding a few raisins was a good source
> of yeast. Of course nowadays since we can buy dried yeasts the raisins
> would not be needed for this.

It's possible. FWIW, both the Plat Bottle Ale recipe and the kvass
recipe I used did call for other yeast sources for primary fermentation.
It _is_ possible, I suppose, that you get a different product,
flavorwise, with the addition of a small amount of a more wine-like
yeast, but I don't see it as necessary for either the main fermentation
or carbonation in a bottled product.

Adamantius

Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2000 07:32:20 EDT
From: CBlackwill at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Kvas

>  If I remember correctly, the skins on grapes and raisins are a good source
>  > of yeasts. It may simply be that adding a few raisins was a good source
>  > of yeast. Of course nowadays since we can buy dried yeasts the raisins
>  > would not be needed for this.

Malolactic fermentation in the bottle, acheived by adding fruit to the 
yeast-rich beer , will certainly produce a different flavor than simply 
adding another dose of "priming sugar" or yeast.  I think this may be the 
reason for adding the raisins, rather than the yeast they may or may not 
provide.  The world famous Lambic beer out of Belgium uses malolactic 
fermentation (in the fermenting tank, I believe), as well as a strain of wild 
yeast specific to the general area, to produce one of the most uniquely 
flavored ales in the world.  If you have never tried a Belgian Lambic, I 
would highly reccommend (are there too many letters in that word?  Or is it 
just really late?) it.  It is, in my opinion, the true "champagne" of beers.  
Sour, sweet, and highly fruity, with a fine bubble very similar to champagne. 
 Lindemanns Lambic is available in the US, and is a quality product.  of 
course, it is not cheap...try $3-4 per bottle.

Balthazar of Blackmoor

Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2000 07:52:00 -0400
From: Elaine Koogler <ekoogler at chesapeake.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Kvas

I discussed this recipe last night with my lord, who is a much more experienced
and accomplished brewer...and coincidentally bakes wonderful breads.  He said
that the bread that is included in most of the kvass recipes is the additional
source of yeast for the fermentation.  Of course, that's not to say that the
raisins are there for the same purpose.  What I remember of the kvass I drank in
Russia is that it had a slightly fruity taste, which could have been the result
of the addition of the raisins.

Kiri

Date: Tue, 06 Jun 2000 15:28:47 -0500
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: SC - Re: Kvas (was Bounced message from Philip Lewis)

>I took some boiling water and added some pnkl bread and honey.  when
>it cooled i added a couple mint leaves, and pitched the yeast.
>i let it ferment and fed it honey over several weeks...
>Straining it was a pain, let me tell you.. ;)
>
>I mentioned I had some to a ukrainian friend who agreed to try it.  He
>said it was definatly kvas, but *extreamly* strong... apparently it
>was more of a kvas wine.. ;)

Good gods, I'll say!  LIGHTLY fermented, lightly fermented!  No more than a
few days, please!  After all, most Russians give this stuff to their
children as a summertime beverage and specifically call it a non-alcoholic
beverage (it only has a teeny little bit of alcohol when it is ready).

Most of the Russian recipes for bread kvas I've seen call for the bread to
be dried first.  The finished rusks are called "sukhari", which translates
directly to "dried things."  I know some recipes toast the bread, but since
the prepared bread (in the Russian recipes, anyway) is usually called
"sukhari" and not "grenoki" (toasted/grilled breads), I'm not sure toasted
bread would be right for making kvas, at least not this variety (there are
lots, after all).  Just theorizing here, I have no proof.

- --Yana 

Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 10:24:17 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Kvas

Nicolas Steenhout wrote:
> When I made Kvas, I didn't know I was about to make lethal weapons!
>
> Granted, it's likely more the mistakes of an over enthusiastic brewing 20
> year old than kvas' fault...
>
> I actualy put the raisin in, then capped...
>
> Within a week or so, I heard bombs go off in the cool storage where my
> brews were stored.  I didn't dare go in there for another few days, as
> they kept on exploding and making mean sounds.
>
> When I went in, I had glass debris all over, some stuck to the ceiling,
> some to the walls, with dried up kvas, and in some places, I could identify
> left over raisin!
>
> None of the other brews I did turned out that way...  <shrug>

I suspect that the kvass itself wasn't finished fermenting before
bottling. When I tried this, using raisins (which turned back into
grapes in the process), I think we had one buster, and the others were
fine. The single explosion we had may have been a fault in the bottle,
or extra-sweet raisins, something like that.

I found that the stuff was drinkable, but not that good, after about ten
days in the bottle, excellent after two weeks, and then downhill from
there. But yes, very different from beer. More like a mint-flavored
small ale.

Adamantius

Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2010 09:35:29 -0500
From: "Phil Troy / G. Tacitus Adamantius" <adamantius1 at verizon.net>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] OT/OOP Kvass Recipe

"KVASS

"A very refreshing Russian beverage which is made in many Russian households about once a week.

" 'With eight quarts water take 1 1/2 lbs. malt, 1 lb. rye flour, 1 1/2 lbs. sugar, 1/8 of a lb. mint leaves, half pepper pod, and half cake of yeast. Mix the malt and flour with boiling water and make a thick dough. Put into barely warm oven and leave for the night.

" ' Next day dilute dough with eight quarts boiling water and pour into a wooden tub. Let stand for 12 hours, then pass through a cloth. Pour one quart into an enamel saucepan, put on fire, add 1 1/2 lb. sugar and an infusion made with the mint leaves (resembling weak tea). Boil once, then take off fire, cool until just warm, and add the yeast previously diluted with one cup of this same warm liquid. Let stand in a warm place until it begins to ferment; then pour into the rest of the kvass in the wooden tub, and let it stand until bubbles appear. Prepare clean bottles, putting one malaga raisin into each; pour in the kvass, cork the bottles, tie the corks with string to the neck of the bottles, and keep in a warm place for a day or two. Then put in a cold cellar.' --R.C.B." 

I can't find R.C.B. [Russian Cookery Book? -- just a guess] listed in the bibliographical source appendix, but this is published in Andre L. Simon's "Concise Encyclopedia Of Gastronomy", Harcourt, Brace, New York, 1952, ISBN 0-87951-134-6

My recollection of actually making this stuff was that we had a couple bottles explode, and it was really, really good at about two weeks old, then dropped in quality fairly rapidly.

On the other hand, it's a really good recipe to start with if you're playing around with infusion mashes and just wrapping your head around the concept of throwing boiling water over grains, which many people assume won't work or will destroy the grain. Which it can, but this assumes that "no thermometer = uncontrolled, random conditions," which is not necessarily a valid assumption.

Adamantius

Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2010 08:44:17 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] OT/OOP Kvass Recipe

There appears to be a good rundown on making Kvass in the SCA at:
http://jducoeur.org/Carolingia/orlando_kvass.html

Johnnae

Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 20:39:55 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>
To: <yaini0625 at yahoo.com>,	"Cooks within the SCA"
	<sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] American Substitution and Translation

<<< I have a new cookbook that have many recipes requiring quark and kvass.
What is quark called in the United States? I don't want to use cottage 
cheese. Any ideas for substitutions or recipes? >>>

Try looking for "farmer's cheese," a white colored cheese made without 
rennet.

<<< As for kvass, the book calls it "bread soup" but I also know it as an 
alcohol drink. Any ideas what this could be or use as a substitute?

Aelina the Saami >>>

Unless your liquor store can get kvass from the Beaver Brewing Company of 
Beaver Falls, PA, try using a wheat beer.  While kvass is commonly made from 
rye bread, it is also made from wheat bread, so a wheat beer will probably 
give you the closest match OTC.

Bear

Date: Mon, 7 May 2012 12:21:27 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>
To: <yaini0625 at yahoo.com>,	"Cooks within the SCA"
	<sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Hildegard's recipes wasRe: American Substitution
	and	Translation

If this is From St. Hildegard's Kitchen, then the recipes are modern 
(potatoes, tomatoes, choclate, etc.).

It is worth noting that the term "kvass" shows up in Russian around mid-16th 
Century according to one source.  However, the oldest recipe (sort of) for 
beer made from barley bread is Sumerian, about 3500 years old (IIRC).

Bear

<<< I am unsure of the date on the actual recipe but it is in a cookbook 
collection that has been modeled on the writings of Hildegard of Bingen. 
The date given is 1098-1179. Her biography states that she wrote on the 
connection between nature, folk remedies and the use of food to balance the 
humors.
Aelina >>>

<<< Do we actually have period recipes for it, or are you reconstructing a
plausible guess at how they did it in period based on how it was done 
later?
-- 
David/Cariadoc >>>

Date: Mon, 07 May 2012 11:35:13 -0700
From: David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>
To: yaini0625 at yahoo.com, Cooks within the SCA
	<sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] American Substitution and Translation

Checking an English translation of Hildegard's Physica, I find several 
references to rye but none to rye soup, none to fermenting it, and none 
to kvass. Mostly it's being used in medical/magical contexts, to cure 
things.

I don't know what the collection you are referring to is, but if it's 
modern I would not count on the recipes being period unless it actually 
quotes the original. There's a widely circulated recipe for what claim 
to be Hildegard's spice cookies that has almost nothing in common with 
the real thing.

There is a reference in Hildegard to the use of hops in beer, apparently 
the first such reference--is it possible that that's what your source is 
refering to?

<the end>

Edited by Mark S. Harris	kvass-msg	Page  of