Title: soapmaking-msg
Subject: Soapmaking. Period and modern techniques.
Author: Edited by Mark S. Harris
Last saved by: Mark S. Harris
Keywords: soap, soapmaking, medieval, craft, lye, fat, ashes, Castile

soapmaking-msg - 2/3/08

Soap making. Period and modern techniques.

NOTE: See also the files: soap-msg, Soapmakng-CMA-art, Lye-Soap-art, bathing-msg, Roman-hygiene-msg, Tubd-a-Scrubd-art, Man-d-Mujeres-art, p-hygiene-msg, Perfumes-bib, perfumes-msg.

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NOTICE -

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I  have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

I  have done  a limited amount  of  editing. Messages having to do  with separate topics  were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the  message IDs  were removed to save space and remove clutter.

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make  no claims  as  to the accuracy  of  the information  given  by the individual authors.

Please  respect the time  and  efforts of  those who have written  these messages. The  copyright status  of these messages  is  unclear  at this time. If  information  is  published  from  these  messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

Thank you,
    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: ac508 at dayton.wright.EDU (Beverly Roden)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Soapmaking Resource
Date: 22 Mar 1994 06:08:37 -0500

Good Gentles in search of Cleanliness:

Sorry I am that I missed the original thread, but if you wish a resource
person to learn more about soapmaking (and other related herb-crafts such
as hand creams), write to:

Mistress Ilyana/Catherine Oyler - 1467 Hunters Ln, Radcliffe, KY 40160

Mistress Alexis MacAlister                 Beverly Roden
Mistress of Arts of the Midrealm           Mistress of My Two Dogs

From: ag60046004 at aol.com (Ag60046004)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Rosewater
Date: 13 Mar 1997 12:01:35 GMT

Greetings, Rayne!

While I don't have a period recipe for rosewater, I've found a
non-measured recipe for it
in "The Complete Soapmaker", a book by Norma Coney (Sterling Publishing
Co., NY, published 1996).  On page 62, it reads as follows:

"Method for Making Rose Water

"To prepare rose water, first gather fresh rose blossoms; do this during
the morning, after the dew [h]as evaporated.  Place the petals in a glass,
stainless steel, or enamel saucepan and cover them with distilled water. 
Weigh the floating petals down with a heat-resistant glass dish."

"Pleace the pan over low heat and allow the pot to release steam for at
least an hour.  You should begin to see drops of rose oil floating on the
surface of the water.  Do not allow the water to boil."

"When the water has taken on a rosy hue, feels thick and soft, and shows
evidence of rose oil on its surface, strain the liquid through a tea
strainer, using your fingers to press all the liquid from the petals. 
Store in refrigerator.  (Note that rose water may be used as a skin toner;
apply to the face with a cotton ball)."

Further on the same page, the author adds, "(Freshly prepared rose water
made from red roses will do a good job of coloring [the] soap, so you may
wish to leave out the extra dye.)"

<snip>

Last note: If you or any other reader of this post is interested in
soapmaking, I *highly*
recommend the book listed near the beginning of this post.  Very
practical, thourough, explanatory, and great illustrations & pictures! 
Lists of bibliography and suppliers are good, too.  The only drawback is
that you get great, inspirational photos, and no scent to accompany the
pictures.  :-(  Oh, darn: guess I'll just have to experiment...  :-)

Hope this information helps!

In Service,
Anneliese Grossmund
Barony of Mag Mor, Kingdom of Calontir

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 1997 21:48:15 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - Cheese recipes

Kerridwen wrote:
> Not quite cooks related, but does anyone have a source for period soap
> recipes?

I know there's a soap recipe in Thomas Dawson's "The Second Part of 'The
Good Huswifes Jewell' "... 

G. Tacitus Adamantius

From: nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt)
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 08:06:26 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: SC - Soap

Just taking the Good Huswife's Jewel back to the library so I have it with me:

To make good sope.

First you must take half a strike of (asshen?) ashes, and a quart of Lime,
then you must mingle both these together, and then must fill a pan full of
water and seeth them well, so done, you must take four pound of beastes
tallow, and put it into the Lye, and seeth them togther until it be hard.

Clare R. St. John

From: "Sharon L. Harrett" <afn24101 at afn.org>
To: Mark Harris
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 09:41:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: SC - soap and cheese info source

	I have not yet found a period recipe for basic soap, but there are
two "milled soap" recipes in "Delights for Ladies, Sir Hugh Plat,1609"
chapter on Sweet powders and ointments. It is in Cariadoc's collection.

Ceridwen

From: OElaineO at aol.com
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 10:12:30 -0400 (EDT)
To: markh at risc.sps.mot.com
Subject: craft link

Free recipes and directions for making bar soap located at
http://members.aol.com/oelaineo/soapmaking.html

From: Library Staff <betpulib at ptdprolog.net>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Gifts - any ideas?
Date: 24 Jun 1997 19:14:07 GMT
Organization: Bethany Public Library

> Our little group seems to have run out of ideas for gifts for
> royals (well, we had LOTS of good ideas, but they all seem to
> have occurred to other people has well!).
>
> Any ideas?

From the July/August Issue of Family Life magazine:

Soaps with "surprises" in them (simple enough for a children's craft w/ 
adult supervision).
(edited for relevance and to save bandwidth)

Ingredients:
1 bar clear, unscented glycerine soap
Beads, seashells, glitter, plastic confetti in shapes, other small 
"surprises" and found objects.
Molds or mini loaf pans
Essential oils (lavender, rosemary and thyme are nice)

Directions

1. Put one bar of glycerine soap in a bowl and zap in the microwave for 
60 seconds, or melt it in a double boiler (10 to 15 minutes). When done, 
pour about 1/4 inch of melted soap into mold or mini bread pan. Let 
harden slightly (3-5 minutes).
2. Scatter small toys or other found objects face down on top of the 
hardened soap in the mold. Reheat the remaining soap. Add one drop of the 
essential oil, and mix with a fork. Pour a second, thicker layer on top, 
sealing the prizes inside. Let harden about 30 minutes. When done, have 
an adult run a sharp knife around the edges and (may have to run the mold 
under hot water to loosen) then let the soap maker smack the pan facedown 
against the counter. The soap will pop out. It looks fine like this, but 
can also be cut into small, chunky blocks.

Candy molds make the soap go farther and look prettier.

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 21:56:34 +0600
From: james mabrey <braefiddich at sprintmail.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Soap Making Article

Gillian:

I enjoyed your article on soapmaking very much.  Well done.  A few
things we have found in our soapmaking - If you want to hurry up
removing your soap from the molds, after the 48 hours or so of
hardening, you can put it in the freezer overnight.  It pops right out
of the molds.  My mother's castilian, which of course is strictly olive
oil for fat, does not have the problem with the oil coming to the top
after pouring in the mold.  I'll check with her for details.

We have always placed our additives directly into the initial soap
mixture, just prior to pouring. (essential oils, pumice, herbs, etc.). 
I have not noticed any problems in the final products.

If one wants to make a soap with a higher content of goats milk (or
other milk), replace some of the water with a equal amount of milk in
the initial recipe.  The temperature is really important here!  If it is
too high you will carmelize the milk sugars.  it doesn't hurt the
quality of the soap, it just makes it dark.  We have had good success
with varying quantities of milk.  I guess we could afford
experimentation, as we have a seemingly endless supply of goats milk.

Bronwyn nic Dougal
Calontir

Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 22:58:41 -0500
From: "marilyn traber" <mtraber at email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: SC -Lye from ashes

You derive the lye used in soapmaking from the wood ashes from your
fireplace or wood stove.

According to the foxfire series, you make a trough from whatever wood is on
hand, drill a hole in the bottom. Plug the hole in the bottom, fill it with
ashes, top off with water and let stand for a little while.  Pull the plug
out and drain the liquid out of the trough through coarse muslin to filter
out the ashes. Let stand for a day or so to settle the remains of the ashes
and use in the normal manner of soapmaking.[IE, heat the fat and lye in
different containers to different temperatures, then add the lye to the fat
in constant dribble while stirring. yipee, lots of fun, can smell terrible
depending on what kind of fat you start out with.]
margali

Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:05:40 -0600
From: "Phyllis Spurr" <Phyllis.Spurr at tdh.state.tx.us>
Subject: Re: SC -Lye from ashes

> According to the foxfire series, you make a trough from whatever wood is on
> hand, drill a hole in the bottom. Plug the hole in the bottom, fill it with
> ashes, top off with water and let stand for a little while.  Pull the plug
> out and drain the liquid out of the trough through coarse muslin to filter
> out the ashes. Let stand for a day or so to settle the remains of the ashes
> and use in the normal manner of soapmaking.[IE, eat the fat and lye in
> different containers to different temperatures, then add the lye to the fat
> in constant dribble while stirring. yipee, lots of fun, can smell terrible
> depending on what kind of fat you start out with.]
> margali

I've also made my own lye, in about the same manner.  However, an
easier way to make lye water is to take a coffee can, punch holes in
the bottom, fill with your ashes, place filled coffee can over a
recepticle to catch lye water, pour water into the ashes and let
drain.  Do this several times with fresh ashes each time.  I usually
add a little table salt to strengthen the lye water and strain
through a cloth to remove ash debris.

I try to always use beef tallow for soap making, just my preference.
I don't normally heat my lye prior to adding to the fat.

Phyllis L. Spurr

Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 16:48:33 +0100 (CET)
From: Par Leijonhuvud <pkl at absaroka.obgyn.ks.se>
Subject: Re: SC -Lye from ashes

On Thu, 26 Feb 1998, Phyllis Spurr wrote:
> > You derive the lye used in soapmaking from the wood ashes from your
> > fireplace or wood stove.

> I've also made my own lye, in about the same manner.  However, an
> easier way to make lye water is to take a coffee can, punch holes in
> the bottom, fill with your ashes, place filled coffee can over a
> recepticle to catch lye water, pour water into the ashes and let
> drain.  Do this several times with fresh ashes each time.  I usually
> add a little table salt to strengthen the lye water and strain
> through a cloth to remove ash debris.

I can't recall what pH you need for soapmaking, but for a stronger lye
you can mix ashes with water, and boil the mix (1:2 (V/V, ashes/water)
will typically give pH 11-12, IIRC).

Be careful with strongly alkaline solutions; they are _very_ damaging
to eyes, etc if you mess up. _If_ you do get some in the eyes the
treatment is to rinse with plain water or sterile isotonic saline
(preferred, for obvious reasons) as soon as possible (preferably within
5 seconds...), and keep rinsing until medical attention can be obtained.
There are good reasons why people wear safety goggles in laboratories.

/UlfR

Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:11:59 SAST-2
From: "CHRISTINA van Tets" <IVANTETS at botzoo.uct.ac.za>
Subject: SC - lye, fish, pastry, japanese and horehound

<snip>

2.  Lye can be too strong.  I am told that the correct strength is
when it will float a hardboiled egg but not dissolve a feather.
The people here who demonstrate skills like soapmaking from ash say
that you have to boil the lye and fat together for about an hour.
Bother.  Forgot to bring quantities of lye and fat needed.  Will mail
them at a later date.

Cairistiona nic Bhraonnaguinn
Christina van Tets

Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 08:15:24 -0600
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: RE: SC - lye, fish, pastry, japanese and horehound

> 2) I know how to _make_ lye, but does anyone happen to know what it is
> chemically?? (if only I had paid better attention in Organic Chem all
> those years ago...)
>
> Bogdan

It's probably potassium hydroxide (potash).  Potassium hydroxide and sodium
hydroxide (caustic soda) are both referred to as lye.

Bear

Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:50:21 -0500
From: "marilyn traber" <mtraber at email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: SC - lye, fish, pastry, japanese and horehound

>2) I know how to _make_ lye, but does anyone happen to know what it is
>chemically?? (if only I had paid better attention in Organic Chem all
>those years ago...)

>Bogdan

Sodium hydroxide and / or potassium hydroxide.

potassium hydroxide, KOH, caustic potash.
properties: white deliquescent pieces, lumps, pellets, sticks or flakes
having a crystalline fracture. Keep well stoppered- absorbs water and carbon
dioxide from the air. Soluable in water, alcohol, glycerine, slightly
soluable in ether.
derivation: electrolysis of concentrated KOH solution.
<snippage about purification, grades, containers, hazmat warnings and
shipping regulations. i can post those too if needful>
uses:soap manufacture, bleaching, manufacture of oxalic acid, reagent in
analytic chemistry, matches, process engraving, in foods as an alkali,
electrolyte in soreage batteries.

sodium hydroxide-pretty much the same, deriven from electrolyzing table
salt. chemically known as NaOH.

yummy-just what I want in my lutefisk...

margali

Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 12:11:48 -0500
From: "marilyn traber" <mtraber at email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: SC - soap

a hard white soap: 6.5 lbs rendered fat, 1 can commercial lye, .5 cup
sugar[to make it lather, thats what it says, don't blame me...]

render the fat, grind it finely then place in a shallow pan and put in a
warm oven[250-300*f] pouring off the liquid fat periodically. the whole
process should take a half an hour. strain the resulting liquid through
cheesecloth to remove any crunchy bits. next place the fat into a pot with
an equal amount of water and bring to a boil. Pour the fat off the top and
discard the sediment.

Next, buy a container of flake lye, there are various brands available.

Use only enamel or stainless steel pots. next, it mentions that you add the
lye to the fat and some recipes are not specific, but there is a temperature
guideline for the people who have not grown up making soap, and therefor
don't do it by rote.

sweet lard 85*f, lye solution at 75*f
half lard, half tallow 110*f, lye soln at 85*f
all tallow 130*f, lye soln at 95*f

now, i know people have mentioned on the list they just pours 'em together
and stirs, but since the article also mentions this chart comes off the
package of lye, how about giving it a try in the interest of safety-chemical
caustics combined with organics can have drastic exothermic reactions...we
dont need to lose members of the list for trying to recreate a medieval
soaper who presumably was trined to make soap by the seat of his pants and
probably knew how to figure the temperatures to do it safely...

dissolve sugar in 1 cup very hot water, add this to 4 cups warm water. now
empty a can of  lye slowly into the mixture and stir. the lye will heat up
on contact with the water  and cause fumes therefor it should be done
outside or in a well ventilated place. it is also a good precaution to have
on hand a glass of vinegar in water to sip to stop  coughing or to wash
drips on the skin.

as the temperatures of both liquids reach those speecfied, pour the fat into
the lye in a thin stream, stirring constantly. when the mixture approximates
the consistancy of honey, pour the liquid soap into a shallow pan or box
that has been lined with a cloth wrung out in cold water. score the soap
when slightly hardened. when set cut into squares/unmold and store.

note- it should cool and harden slowly, it says that you can set it out
under blankets to insulate and retain the heat or  since this is a self
sufficiency book, slide it under a woodstove used for heating and that it
should take several days to cure before cutting/unmolding.

[the book says 10 lb potash, 20 lbs grease - Margali 2/28/98]

margali

Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 16:05:28 -0500
From: "Karen Lyons-McGann" <dvkld.dev at mhs.unc.edu>
Subject: SC - soap

Hmm, I hadn't been reading lately, but in trying to catch up, I see posts
from Sunday about soap making.  I've had these instructions for several
years, though I haven't tried them yet.  The quantities look more
manageable for a beginner than the version I'm responding to that wants 6
and a half pounds of rendered fat.   And look, doesn't Elina of Beckenham
sound SCA? Evidently she's got a book and everything.  How about that?
Anne

- ----------------------------------------------------
SOAP   SOAP   SOAP   SOAP

Since I have posted my request about soap making, I have gotten several
requests to forward the information. I have continued investigating on my
own and here is some info to get those of you started.

Condensed from Soapmaking for the Beginner by Elina of Beckenham

You will need a glass or ceramic mixing bowl of medium size. A wooden
spoon... stainless steel will do in a pinch. Under no circumstances should
aluminum be used for anything in this process. Lye dissolves aluminum. You
need a measuring cup. That's it for hardware.

Lard can be found at the grocery store next to the Crisco. A one pound box
of lard will make two batches of soap. Lye is next to the Drano. One can
will be plenty.

The only other thing needed is a mold. A Pyrex dish will be fine.

1. Measure 4 oz. lukewarm water into the Pyrex measuring cup. You need to
use something that can take the sudden heat. Carefully add 2 tablespoons of
lye. Stir. Let sit.

2. Heat about half a pound of the lard (8 oz.) until liquid. Pour into
mixing bowl.

3. Let both cool down before they are mixed to about body temp. Check the
lye by feeling the OUTSIDE of the Pyrex cup.

4. When they have cooled, slowly add the lye to lard and stir constantly
until step 5.

5. When the goop has reached the consistency of sour cream (this will take a
while of constant stirring - keep stirring until it does this. I played a
computer game), add any colors (food coloring ok) or perfumes, spices, or
whatever. Then pour into your mold.

6. Cover with a towel and let sit for 24 hours.

7. Uncover after 24 hours and unmold on the 2nd or 3rd day. Let the soap sit
or cure for 3-4 weeks.

I did this and as long as you keep the stirring up until the sour cream
consistancy, it will turn out!

OTHER STUFF TO DO WITH THE GOOP
Butter soap - Good for the skin instead of lard use butter
Castille soap - Replace 3/4 the lard with 6oz. olive oil
Rose soap - Use rose water, not tap and throw in a handful of dried
petals
Orange soap - Grate an orange peel and throw in a tablespoon or two
Cinnamon soap - One tablespoon ground cinnamon

*** I also found a craft gopher that supply info and more recipes can be
found. The address is gopher.crafts-council.pe.ca

Enjoy!

Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:38:21 -0800
From: Tobi_Beck at amat.com
Subject: SC - Re: soap

>Hi Tobi,
>I got this message on the SCA-Cook's list. Do you have a book (or is
>this a class handout)? If a whole book exists, is there more medieval
>soapmaking in it? Can I use plastic measuring spoons for the Lye? Will
>the soap just "shake out" of the moulds? Can I use aluminium or plastic
>moulds?
>I was planning on trying soap making this year and have been looking <for
>information. If you want to reply to the SCA-Cooks list, their address
>is sca-cooks at Ansteorra.ORG
>Thanks for any help,
>Crystal of the Westermark
>(Crystal A. Isaac)
>Karen Lyons-McGann (Anne) dvkld.dev at mhs.unc.edu wrote:

Wow, be careful what you write, you never know what is going to happen to
it.   I wrote that article 10 years ago!  To answer your questions:

Not a book, just a pamphlet, go to www.geocities.com/athens/forum/1487 and
follow the links to Beckenhall (the craft side of our pages).  You will
find the whole article.  I'll be posting more on there, but if your
interested in French milled soap, take the basic recipe (no spices or
scents) and let it cure.  Grate it with a food grater and measure 1 part
water to 2 parts soap and melt in cooking pan over low heat.  Stir slowly
so as not to make a lather.  When all the soap melts, mould into forms
(candy forms, egg holders, be creative).  Cool for half an hour and pop out
of moulds.  Let sit for 2 weeks, It makes a great soap, with good detail in
the mould.  You can also add essence oils, rose water, spices and the like
just before you take it off the heat.  Experiment, have fun!  Try a half
cup of oat meal and milk instead of water, or cornmeal and witchhazel (talk
about a skin cleanser!), Aloe and Lanolin, all things from the drug store.
Add three parts water to 1 soap and you get liquid soap.  The best thing of
these is that there is only what you put in.  I have a nurse friend who is
allergic to most soaps, but has no problem with these.

Next question:  NO ALUMINIUM!  NO WAY NO HOW!  It's very messy, take my
experience, just don't do it. Plastic if fine, not medieval, but very
useful.

Next:  In the basic soap recipe, the soap will not shake out of the mould,
it needs persuasion,  in the French milled stage, they pop out like
chocolates. ( I once made a cinnamon soap using Christmas candy moulds and
had someone mistake them for chocolates on the counter.   He thought he was
snitching a chocolate, big surprise.  Almost as good as the lady who found
some juice in the back of the fridge, and discovered that dye liquors in
alum base, are not all that good.  My house is not normally hazardous.)

Yes, Elina of Beckenham is an SCA name.  Was Trimaris, now West.  This
internet thing is amazing, gives credence that there are no more than seven
degrees of separation around the world.

Elina

From: "Pamela Love, Owner" <pam at soapcrafters.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Soap Making
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 21:17:19 -0600
Organization: Soap Crafters Company

If anyone is into making their own soap, here are tons
of instructions, recipes and some photos:
http://www.soapcrafters.com
--
Soap Crafters Company (801)474-2993
Soap Base, Molds!, Essential Oils & Bulk Herbs
Soap Making Instructions
http://soapcrafters.com

Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 13:55:15 EST
From: DianaFiona at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - lard, was Which books?

renfrow at skylands.net writes:
<< <snip>  Hello!  Welcome to the list.  I've found solid 1-lb. blocks of lard
 -- "manteca" -- in shops catering to Spanish-speaking folks.

Cindy/Sincgiefu >>

  I'm in the South also, as I believe, is the original poster, and I can get
it easily in big blocks in some of the grocery stores. Just used some in a
soapmaking experiment, which seems to have turned out fine so far. (Good
thing--Christmas is fast approaching and this seems to have developed into
my big project for the year!   :-) )

                Ldy Diana

[contributed by "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: sunshinegirl <sunshinegirl at steward-net.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Monday, November 23, 1998 11:40 PM
Subject: HERB - one bar recipe for soap

_Back to Basics_, by Reader's Digest  (a wonderful "how to" book,) has
some soap recipies.  It states that "According to Roman legend, soap was
discovered after a heavy rain fell on the slopes of Mount Sapo (the name
means "Mount Soap" in Latin).  The hill was the site of an important
sacrificial altar, and the rainwater mixed with the mingled ashes and
animal fat around the altar's base.  As a result..., the three key
components of soap were brought together:  water, fat, and lye (postash
leached from the ashes)."

Although, by definition, every soap is made by the saponification (chemical
combination) of lye, water, and fat, one soap will differ from the next
depending on the kind of fat, the kind of lye, and how much of each is
used.  Traditionally, soapmaking for the year was done in Autumn, when the
annual butchering of animals took place and fat was available.  Lye was
produced by filling a hkopper with hardwood ashes, and running water
through the ashes.  Once this was done, the water was sent through again,
until it would float an egg.  If the egg sank to the bottom, it was too
weak.  If it floated at the top, it was too strong.  If it floated in
suspension, in the middle, it was just right.

Ingredients for soap are
fat - any kind of pure animal or vegetable fat, from reclaimed kitchen
grease to castor oil; tallow, lard, olive oil, crisco vegetable shortning, etc.

lye - Available in many supermarkets or hardware stores in dry crystal -
sodium hydroxide.  My personal choice is Red Devil Lye, found in the drain
cleaner sections.

water - soft.  Clean rainwater is nice.  Add some borax if in a hard water
area.

Recipie for single bar experimentation

1/2 cup cold soft water
2 heaping tbsp. commercial lye
1 cup melted beef tallow
Gloves (unless you want to live dangerously and risk a lye burn...)

Slowly add the lye to the water, then bring both lye solution and tallow
to about body temperature.  Do not touch the lye water - it will burn.  
In fact, be very careful with the lye.

Combine lye water and tallow in a glass bowl and mix slowly and steadily
with an egg beater (I use a fork with the small quantities) until the
consistency is that of sour cream.  Pour mixture into mold and age
according to standard procedure - i.e. remove soap from mold after 24
hours, leave in the open for 2-3 weeks, turning over daily.  If it stays
too soft after a couple of days, then place it over low heat until it
melts, and then stir until ready to pour into molds.

A standard batch recipe calls for on 13 oz can of commerical lye, 2 1/2
pints of water, and 6 pounds of fat.  about 9 punds of soap result,
enough to make 36 bars of toilet soap.

Adding the lye to the water will generate temperatures in excess of 200 F,
so plan on enough time for it to cool.

If adding a scent, don't add the oil until just before molding.  Or make an
infusion, strain, and use that instead of plain water.  Don't use alchohal
based scents - it can interfere with saponification.    Use the single bar
recipie and experiment with different fats, scents, and additives.  I
haven't bought commercial soap in years - I'd rather make my own!!

Have fun, and if anyone has any questions, I'll be happy to answer them to
my best ability.  If anyone else has a different one bar recipie, I'd love
to have it.

Melandra of the Woods

[Contributed by  "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: Gaylin Walli <g.walli at infoengine.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Tuesday, November 24, 1998 11:13 AM
Subject: HERB - Jasmine's one bar soap recipes

Here are some test soap recipes I promised that people can use when
experimenting with herbal and herbal essence additions to
assist them in their recreational endeavors (i.e. SCA research
at its finest!). Be careful with this stuff. Don't blindly make
soap because you think you can. Be sure you can. This weekend
I made an 11 pound batch using every possible safety procedure I
know and I *still* got three lye burns, one on my face and one
on each forearm, even though I was wearing long sleeves, heavy
rubber gloves, and safety glasses.

My measures are pretty exact and are intended to have very
close to 5% excess fat/oil when the saponification process is
done. You can increase the percentage a bit as you decrease the
lye in small increments (even increments as small as 1/100th of
an ounce). I can help you increase or decrease this amount as
needed. If anyone would like to learn the calculations, I'd be happy
to teach you how, assuming you can follow the logic of someone
who abhors simple math. :)

Now, you'll notice I didn't include anything for shortening bars.
You'll find a shortening recipe occasionally on the net called
"Tony's No Fail Soap." Don't use it. The quality & makeup
of shortening varies widely throughout the US and the world.
There's simply no good way to determine what percentages of
ingredients will exist in the shortening in your area and even
then, the brand you buy will cause changes in your calculations.

The last recipe is the one I use the most often and the
olive oil test bar is the one I use second most for testing.
If you have some other oil I've not listed here or some
combination you'd like to see, I can either tell you or show
you. Just let me know. -- Jasmine

PS: One fluid ounce (US) equals a eeny weeny bit more than 2
tablespoons of liquid (US). 4 fluid ounces (US) equals 1/2
cup (US).

All Tallow Test Bar
-------------------
8 ounces tallow (measured when solid)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.07 ounces sodium hydroxide (by weight)

All Lard Test Bar
-----------------
8 ounces lard (by weight)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.05 ounces sodium hydroxide (by weight)

All Canola Oil Test Bar
-----------------------
8 ounces canola oil (by weight)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.05 ounces sodium hydroxide (by weight)

All Peanut Oil Test Bar
-----------------------
8 ounces peanut oil (by weight; I use blended, not extra virgin)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.03 ounces sodium hyrdroxide (by weight)

All Safflower Oil Test Bar
--------------------------
8 ounces safflower oil (by weight; I use blended, not extra virgin)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.03 ounces sodium hyrdroxide (by weight)

All Olive Oil Test Bar
----------------------
8 ounces olive oil (by weight; I use blended or pomace,
  not extra virgin olive oil)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.03 ounces sodium hyrdroxide (by weight)

Olive, Coconut, & Palm Oil Test Bar
-----------------------------------
4 ounces olive oil (by weight)
2 ounces coconut oil (by weight)
2 ounces palm oil (by weight)
3 fluid ounces water (distilled or filtered)
1.13 ounces sodium hydroxide (by weight)

[submitted by "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: Sheron Buchele/Curtis Rowland <foxryde at verinet.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Tuesday, November 24, 1998 6:19 PM
Subject: Re: HERB - Re: Soda ash problem??

mikel at pdq.net writes:
>  How do you take care of the soda ash that forms on the bars?  If you are
> giving them as gifts the ash makes the bars not quite as appealing.

I have really enjoyed the soap chat and look forward to using the single
bar recipes.  I don't know why I never thought about just making a bar to
try something new!

In haste as the Christmas rush is deeply upon our business (we hope to have
a web page soon with all our products and such - I'll let the list know
when) but I needed to comment on soda ash on the soap.

I make soap professionally - around 15 to 20 - 3 pound batches per month.
I had a lot of trouble with ashing on soap when I used shortening and tap
water.  But it varied from time to time - as I think Jasmine pointed out,
the oil blend of shortening changes.  I now use about 1/2 cup of shortening
in 4 cups of oils and I also use about a tablespoon of beeswax per batch.
I also superfat all of my soaps.  I also started using RO water to make
soap about the same time.  I don't know which made the difference and don't
have the time to find out.  But now, I never have any problem with ash.
Even my cinnamon soap which is a very deep brown color stays clear (and I
dispaired for over a year on this soap)!

I find that if the bar has "ashed" it will also sweat badly if stored
plastic.  I put my soap in plastic shoe boxes to store and travel.  When at
home, I turn the lid upside down to let the soap "breathe".   Sweating soap
ruins labels so I was very motivated to get rid of the powdery residue.

Baroness Leonora
Outlands

[submitted by "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: Jan Ward <hawksbluff at yahoo.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Wednesday, November 25, 1998 2:55 AM
Subject: HERB - Soap-superfatting to avoid soda ash

The recipe I used for soap comes from "The Soap Book" by Sandy Maine,
Interweave Press.
I added a little more fat, in the form of a small jar of cocoa-butter,
the juice of a medium sized Aloe leaf, and a couple of vitamin E
pills. Actually, I'm not sure the last two are fats, but they seemed
like a good idea, so I added them.

The recipe in the book calls for:
24 ounces olive oil
24 ounces cocoanut oil
38 ounces of Crisco
12 oz. sodium hydroxide (lye)
32 ounces rain, spring, distilled or tap water (I use distilled)
4 oz. essential oil (I combined cinnamon and cloves)

This was my first time making soap. It seemed to take about a week to
really set up. Part of it mushed up as I removed it from the tray, so
I just squished it into balls and let it dry that way. I tried it
after another week, and it was still fairly strong and irritating to
my hands.  However, after about a month of curing, it turned into the
best soap I ever used. It lathers great, does not melt in the soap
dish, and leaves my skin soft as a baby's. Nothing like "grandma's lye
soap".

Edwinna

[contributed by "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: Gaylin Walli <g.walli at infoengine.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Wednesday, November 25, 1998 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: HERB - Soap-superfatting to avoid soda ash

Edwinna wrote:
>I added a little more fat, in the form of a small jar of cocoa-butter,

While I am by no means an expert in the field of soap making, I think
this is the source of half of your problems, unfortunately. How much
is a small jar? Even a very small amount is going to cause your soap
to change drastically. However, in my opinion, erring on the fat
side is far safer than erring on the lye side.

>the juice of a medium sized Aloe leaf, and a couple of vitamin E
>pills. Actually, I'm not sure the last two are fats, but they seemed
>like a good idea, so I added them.

The last two are not fats. :) The aloe may help with skin irritations,
however, I think current research suggests that the heat of the reaction
between the fats and the lye water destroy the good things that aloe
does. The vitamin E, however, acts as a preservative, fortunately, I
don't know how the high temperatures of the soap making process affect
that oil. I could find out if you're interested.

>38 ounces of Crisco

This is probably the source of the other half of your problems.
As I mentioned previously, the only way to be truly sure that
you will get a good soap mix is to use a shortening that is 100%
of a *specific* vegetable oil. Not just "100% vegetable oil" on
the label, either. They have to list specifically which plant it
came from. And when they do that, then you can calculate how much
lye and water to use. Without that information, it's sort of a
crap shoot. Different parts of the country receive different
versions of Crisco, as I understand it, to account for geographical
and cultural differences (i.e. hotter areas receive different
Crisco than colder areas; places that deep fry more receive a
different kind than areas that do more baking).

So, let's do a little calculating. These were your ingredients:

24 ounces olive oil
24 ounces cocoanut oil
38 ounces of Crisco

This recipe, using 32 oz of water and 12 ounces of lye already
has your recipe superfatted to about 8%. That's a good amount
of superfatting to start with. Now, you say you added a small jar
of cocoa-butter. Let's say for arguments sake you used about a
4 ounce jar. By increasing the fat in your recipe by these 4 oz,
you've increased your superfatting (or the lye discount, as some
people call it) to around 11%. That's way too much for a hard soap,
I think. Staying between 5-8% is probably a better idea. Lower
than 5% is personal preference, and higher than 8 percent starts
seriously affecting the curing time, the hardness, and the shelf
life (because your soap can go rancid with too much fat).

>It seemed to take about a week to really set up. Part of it mushed
>up as I removed it from the tray,

I'm going to assume that you got the whole mix to start tracing,
right? When it's like thin pudding that you can write your name
in if you drizzle some of the mixture on top of itself? It seems
odd that the mix took a week to set up. The only soaps I've had
do that are all-olive soaps or very large batches (10 lbs of
ingredients).

Another idea I just thought of was that you might not have
kept the mix warm enough while it was in the mold. That could
account for the fact that it irritated your hands and also
was still mushy in the center. Blankets blankets blankets!

You say you:
>just squished it into balls and let it dry that way.

Probably one of the better things you could have done. I congratulate
you on your first soap making expedition. You have been far more
successful than I was the first *several* times I made soap. :)
I cringe when I think of the things I did to my kitchen then.

>after another week, and it was still fairly strong and irritating to
>my hands.

Did it burn? If it did, that probably means the oil and lye didn't
react completely, or the lye was never really completely mixed in.
There are a lot of variables here, so it's really hard to know for
sure.

>However, after about a month of curing, it turned into the
>best soap I ever used. It lathers great, does not melt in the soap
>dish, and leaves my skin soft as a baby's. Nothing like "grandma's lye
>soap".

The "lye soap" problem that so many people get squeamish about is
often the result of brainwashing. All soap is lye soap with the
exception of those made with potassium hydroxide (liquid soaps or
soft soaps typically use this). The variables that our grandmothers
had to deal with are not the same ones that we deal with now. We have
*much* more knowledge about the actual chemistry and variables that
made the soap making process in our ancestors' times quite a gamble.

In any event, congratulations on your first batch of soap!
jasmine

[contributed by: "Philippa Alderton" <phlip at bright.net>]
From: DianaFiona at aol.com <DianaFiona at aol.com>
To: herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG <herbalist at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Wednesday, November 25, 1998 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: HERB - Soap-soda ash(LONG)

 Since this topic is also being discussed on the soap list I read, I thought
I'd send some of their discussions this direction........ Maybe one of the
ideas will help! ;-)

 Ldy Diana

******************************************************************************

Last year at this time I had a terrible soda ash problem.  I experimented
with as many variables as I could and here's what I suggest to those of you
struggling with it now:
*Use your stick blender sparingly
*Mix at temps between 105-115
*Here's the weird one I don't think I've seen contributed. (I don't insulate
my soap, I put it in the oven.  I heartily recommend this procedure if you
haven't tried it yet)  Just before you combine the oil and sodium solution,
place a pan of boiling water in the bottom of the oven.  Don't turn the oven
on!  Close the oven door and in the time it takes you to finish your batch,
the oven is ready.  Is it the extra warmth or the humidity?  I haven't
decided yet but I don't fuss with saran wrap anymore and this has worked
100% for me since.

There's more to this ash problem than oxygen exposure.  Someday maybe we'll
collectively figure it out.
HTH and HAPPY THANKSGIVING,
Claudia
Anderson Soap Works

******************************************************************************

Claudia.....

Ya know....i used to get a lot of ash before i started using Palm
oil....especially on the bars that were straight Crisco Shortening.  It would
appear on ALL sides, cut edges and top (which i always do  the saran wrap
thing).  I insulate after i pour and then cover after the bars are sliced.
Which leads me to believe it may be the combination of oils and  nothing more.
Now with the palm, i have none.  (recipe is  40 oz. palm, 20 olive,
20 oz. coconut and superfat with shea and castor)

Hugs,  Jill in Michigan

******************************************************************************

I use Palm Oil, too, and still have the soda ash problem.  The only batch I
haven't had it with is the latest batch & I covered that with saran wrap
about 5 minutes after I poured into the mold.  I gently layed the wrap
directly onto the soap & tucked it into the corners as best I could.  I
insulated (but peeked several times) for 24 hrs & then cut (I'm too
impatient to wait much longer).  Didn't put the wrap back on the soap after
cutting, just layed it on the racks to dry.  So far, no ash.  My soap
kitchen is in my laundry room so don't have an oven down there (yet!) so
it's easier for me to wrap with saran than risk dumping a whole mold of
soap getting it up the basement stairs.  The oven thing sounds interesting.

Tammy Duriavich
Clean Hands, Warm Heart...
   Handmade Soaps & Bath Products
email: murph at xsite.net

******************************************************************************

The only batch I
haven't had it with is the latest batch & I covered that with saran wrap
about 5 minutes after I poured into the mold.

In my experience this has proved true for me too. Laying plastic-
wrap over the surface of the raw soap prevents soda ash everytime.
As mentioned above it's a good idea to wait those 5 extra minutes after
pouring before covering because it allows the soap to set up a bit so it's
easier to get all of the wrinkles out of the plastic wrap.

Christie

******************************************************************************

l use Palm Oil in my GMS (Goat's Milk Soap) - and I do have soda ash on the
exposed side of
my molded bar!!!  Ends that theory!!!!!!  However, it does not bother
me, nor has it influenced the sales.  Just my 2 cents worth!  Dottie
--
Home of Capri-Dot's Nubians,
Tiny Blessings Dwarf Nubians,
and now, "Capri-Suds", Goat Milk Soap!

Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 18:51:26 EDT
From: <DettaS at aol.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Lye directions

"Tidings from the 18th Century," by Beth Gilgun, has a chapter on soapmaking.
 It covers rendering the fat as well as making your own lye by dripping water
through wood ashes.

Detta

Date: Thu, 03 Jun 1999 18:30:26 -0600
From: Sheron Buchele/Curtis Rowland <foxryde at verinet.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Leonora rants on about soapmaking ;-)

At 06:51 PM 6/3/99 EDT, Detta wrote:
>"Tidings from the 18th Century," by Beth Gilgun, has a chapter on soapmaking.
> It covers rendering the fat as well as making your own lye by dripping water
>through wood ashes.

I must interject here!  In my younger days, I was a docent at the Living
History Farms in Des Moines, Ia.  For a big festival, we made soap from
scratch - rendered fats (it is clear why it is done outside over a fire,
the smell is intense), made lye with a hay filled bucket (takes a long time
-  the test we used was to run the lye through until it dissolves a medium
fine chicken feather - this was mostly done before the festival, we showed
the set up), and then boiled the mess (over the fire in a big iron pot
stirring with a long wood spoon - and don't even get me started on how
wonderful it smelled) until it just about sets up.  Take a paddle and push
it into a wood mold.  The dark evil mess set up and we cut it with in an
hour or so.  The bars dried and just became darker and more evil as they
aged.  Eventually we threw most of it away.  We kept a few "show bars" in
the log cabin but I refused to make it again.  And all in an apron, long
dress and bonnet.

I am glad that I did it, but it was a tremendous amount of work (even if I
was "on the clock") and the outcome was not usable.

This being the SCA arts list , I have to say:  It is my belief that in the
Middle Ages soap was bought from professional Soap Guilds.  It wasn't until
people moved to the New World and away from the professional soap makers
that the average homemaker had to make it herself.  Very much like
breadmaking - professionials have better and more consistant sources for
raw materials and equipment so on a piece by piece basis can do it for less
money.   Look in the Stephan's files for the soap discussion from a while
ago for more info and holding forth of opinions ;-)  He was kind enough to
publish a bit of soap documentation I wrote for a Kingdom A&S somewhere in
there as well that I think is still available.
(**** See Stefan's Florilegium files at:
         http://lg_photo.home.texas.net/florilegium/index.html ****)

Finally, I have to say that as a professional soapmaker, soap is
challenging to make even with pure lye and consistant fats.  I make
hundreds of pounds of soap a year, and I still have failures and
unexplained occurances.  I still choose to make my own soap and have lot of
people that I have taught who make 1 to 2 batches a year who choose to make
their own soap, but it is the single most challenging product that I make
for our business.  I guess I am ranting about this as a way to futher
support the theory that in the Middle Ages, soap was bought from
professionals....

But don't let me discourage you from walking your own path of discovery!
;-)   You may have a much more wonderful and instructive time than I!

Baroness Leonora

PS.  some of my soaper friends swear by rendering fat in the microwave.
They just fill a plastic container with fat scraps and a couple of inches
of water, zap the thing until the scraps are mostly crispy, strain it, put
back in the container, put it in the fridge until the fat sets up, scrape
the bottom of the mass to get the last of the ook out and you have nice
clean fat for almost no money.  Me, I just buy tubs of lard, shortening,
and vats of olive oil.  As my ole pappy used to say "you gots time or you
gots money - but you only spends it once."

Date: Thu, 03 Jun 1999 18:31:29 -0600
From: Sheron Buchele/Curtis Rowland <foxryde at verinet.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Many sources for lye

>A quick question:  Where does one buy lye for making soap?  Thanks.
>Nancy

Easiest to get: Red Devil lye in the plumbing section of the grocery store.
 It is 12 oz. for about $4, here.  Expensive but easy.

You can surf to get a lot of sites that carry soap making supplies that
carry larger quantities of lye.  Shipping adds cost, look to see if one is
local.  Cost per pound of lye is usually somewhat less, though.

If you live near a large city, look in the phone book under chemicals.
Call and ask if they carry sodium hydroxide (for cold process hard soap) in
flake or bead form.  I get it in Denver for $35 for a 50 pound bag of bead.
 I am just about out - took me about 12 months to go through 50 lbs.  Next
time, I am going to try flake.  It gets hotter, but the beads stick to
everything plastic with static electricity.  Cheap buy labor intensive.
You get a lot of stares from the loading dock people unless they are used
to soapers :-)

BTW, if you live in a humid area - figure out a way to keep the lye dry.
It draws moisture from the air and turns into a solid lump which is most
unuseful.  Always check your containers of lye to make sure that they
shake, even in the little plastic containers they can solidify.

Good luck!

Baroness Leonora
who makes up to 90 pounds of soap a month

Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 09:23:59 EDT
From: <Ismaysca at aol.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Leonora rants on about soapmaking ;-)

arianne at blackroot.org writes:
<< But if you use too much lye, it's a health hazard. >>

IMany of the soapmaking suppliers on the web have lye calculators. One in
particular  is Magestic Mountain Sage, sorry I don't have the URL at hand
this instance. Anyway you can list your ingredients and it will calculate the
proper amount of lye to use.

Ismay

Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 08:56:50 PDT
From: pat fee <lcatherinemc at hotmail.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Many sources for lye

Does anyone know where to get palm oil? I understand you need to add this to
make soap "lather"  I have found the documentation for the importation of
palm oil through the "Italian" trade route in period.  Now I just need to
find a source for the oil.
Morganuse

Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 18:50:16 EDT
From: <Ismaysca at aol.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Many sources for lye

lcatherinemc at hotmail.com writes:
<< Does anyone know where to get palm oil? >>

I get mine from Herbal Accents in Encinitas Ca. Their URL is
http://www.herbalaccents.com
BTW the URL for Lye Calculation from Majestic Mountain Sage is
http://www.the-sage.com
They also sell carrier oils.

Ismay

Subject: Homemade Lye recipe here
Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 12:43:51 EDT
From: Skye191016 at aol.com
To: SCA-GARB at LIST.UVM.EDU

Here is the recipe for homemade lye known as "potash":

    First you need a "wooden" bucket/container. (Plastic or metal will
interact with the lye)  The larger the bucket the better since the more ashes
we use, the more concentrated the lye solution.  On them bottom side of this
container, drill a 1/4" hole.  (Get as close to the bottom without drilling
underneath.)  Place this wooden container on cinder blocks or other supports
so that a crock or other enamel pot can be placed under the hole.  Set the
wooden container at an angle with the opening at the lowest point.  "Line"
the bottom of the wooden container with "straw" to act as a strainer.  Pack
the barrel with ashes, preferably from hardwood.  Note:  oak (any type),
hickory, sugar maple, fruit woods, beech, and ash wood produce the strongest
lye.  Finally scoop out a depression at the top enough to hold 2 to 3 quarts
water.  Fill the depression with "distilled" water heated to the boiling
point.  Let it seep through the ashes at will.  It will take a while for the
water to complete its seepage, perhaps as long as several days, depending on
how packed the ashes are.  But, do not hurry this process as it will affect
the quality of the lye.

Although soap can be made directly with this lye solution, it is more
convenient and precise to have the lye in crystal form.  (insures proper
measuring)

To extract lye crystals from this homemade potash, boil down the solution in
a "stainless steel" or enamelware pot.  At first, a dark residue called
"black salts" will form.  This is normal.  By maintaining heat, additional
impurities can be driven off, leaving the desired "grayish white" potash
crystals.  The boil should be kept at a "simmering boil,"  (small bubbles,
NOT a rolling boil).  Until one learns the cooking method that's right for
them, I'd suggest cooking a cup or two of the liquid potash at a time until
you're comfortable identifying the crystals. Note: To test to see if your
liquid potash is concentrated or strong enough for soapmaking, take out a
couple of cups and placed in a bowl to make liquid about 3-4" deep.  Crack a
raw egg in the solution, if the egg "barely" floats, then the lye is good for
soapmaking.

Hope this answers all questions, but feel free to ask if further instructions
or details are necessary.

Happy soaping!
Katerina  :)

Note:  recipe was taken from the Reader's Digest "Back to Basics" book.

Subject: Re: soap/lye
Date: Fri, 03 Sep 1999 16:49:04 -0400
From: Kevin of Thornbury <kevin at maxson.com>
Organization: Barony of Ponte Alto, Kingdom of Atlantia
To: atlantia at atlantia.sca.org

Jessica Wilbur wrote:
> I haven't touched on any safety precautions,
> so let me know if you need more details on how
> to handle lye safely.
>
> Gotta teach a class on this some time...  =)
>
> --Muireann ni Riordain

In case Muireann isn't asked, and doesn't get a chance to respond I will
make one safety comment (which I know Muireann knows full well).

Lye burns.  When you get burned with it (and you will), rinse off the
injury with vinegar to stop the burning.  Lye is a base, and you need
the acid in the vinegar to counteract it.
_____
|_|_|  Kevin of Thornbury
| | |  (Kevin Maxson)
 \|/   kevin at maxson.com   http://www.atlantia.sca.org

Subject: Re: soap/lye
Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 17:32:13 -0400
From: "Jessica Wilbur" <jessica at pop.net>
To: atlantia at atlantia.sca.org

> In case Muireann isn't asked, and doesn't get a chance to respond I will
> make one safety comment (which I know Muireann knows full well).
>
> Lye burns.  When you get burned with it (and you will), rinse off the
> injury with vinegar to stop the burning.  Lye is a base, and you need
> the acid in the vinegar to counteract it.

Thanks Kevin! I probably should have included a few points on dealing with lye.
(I was afraid I'd gone on too long and everyone was asleep on their keyboards!) Anyway, you may not necessarily get burned with lye, if you are careful. I
reccommend wearing rubber gloves while handling it (like the kind for washing dishes or doing icky household chores). It's also a good idea to wear safety goggles, since lye can give off some pretty nasty fumes when mixed with water (as you are supposed to do for soapmaking). Do your mixing in a well-ventilated area (outside is best but if you have a fan on in the kitchen or where ever, you'll probably be all right. Just don't stick your nose in the measuring cup).

Also, a lye/water solution gets HOT. The temperature goes up dramatically,
so be careful. This is why Pyrex is good to use. And use care when pouring the lye solution into the fats, try not to sploosh. This is how I got a minor lye burn and it wasn't fun at all.

--Muireann

Subject: Soap/lye questions
Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 20:50:48 -0700
From: Brenda <adendra at charleston.Net>
To: submission to merry rose <Atlantia at atlantia.sca.org>

I have to agree with Misty on the "Art of Soapmaking". I hooked her up
with that one, and it is one of the easiest books for the beginning
soapmaker. I also like Susan Cavitch's books, The Natural Soap Book" and
"The Soapmaker's Companion", but I'm like Misty in that I can lay my
hands on at least 6-7 books on soap in my library. I also cannot
emphasize the importance of safety when handling lye.I definitely do not
recommend breathing the fumes and I always have vinegar on hand to clean
up spills. I also prefer to use Pyrex for mixing my soap. By the way, I
get my Red Devil lye in the cleaning section of the grocery store
(usually next to the Drano, don't get the two confused).

I personally like the soap that results from using tallow. I make almost
all of my own soap, have for many years. I have been having problems
obtaining beef fat to render into tallow, but I sure would like to hear
>from anyone who has been able to obtain it in small quantities already
rendered.

                                Adendra

Subject: Soapmaking Supply Links
Date: 8 Sep 99 10:18:29 EDT
From: DQueenBee <dqueenbee2 at netscape.net>
To: atlantia at atlantia.sca.org

  A very good web site that has links for soap making supplies
  http://www.lis.ab.ca/walton/old/soaphome.html

Debbie

Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:27:10 MST
From: soapmakers <soap at info9.com>
Subject: Free Soapmaking Message Board, Tips, recipes, Chat NON-COMMERCIAL
To: "Mark.S Harris (rsve60)" <rsve60 at email.sps.mot.com>

Hi, just a line to let you know that the FREE! Soapmakers message board is now "on the air" This is a non-profit TOTALLY NON-COMMERCIAL message board for tips 
and trends in soapmaking.  Please come and share your soapmaking experience 
with us at soapmaking.chatboard.org

Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 10:15:09 -0400
From: "Sharon Gordon" <gordonse at one.net>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] The mystery soap ingredient in context
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Thanks to the people giving it a try so far (even those playing monopoly
with the soap ingredients...sigh... :-) .)

******************
The Secretes of the reverend Maister Alexis of Piemont
containying excellente remedies against diverse
diseases Imprinted at London by Johng Kyngston for
John Wight 1580

p. 52 A very exquisite sope, made of diverse thinges.

Take aluminic casini, three ounces, quick lime one
part, strong lie that will beare and egge swimmyng
between two waters, three pottles, a pot of common
oyle, mingle all well together, puttyng to it the
white of an egge well beaten, and a dishe full of the
meale or floure of amylum, and an unce of romaine or
blewe vitriol well beaten into powder and mixe it
continually for the space of 4 hours, then let it
stand by the space of a daie, and it will be right and
perfect, finally take it out and cut it in peeces :
after sette it to drie two daies in the winde, but not
in the sunne, occupie always of this sope when you
will washe your heade, for it is very holesome, and
maketh faire haire.

Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 11:26:30 -0400
From: johnna holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The mystery soap ingredient in context
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

The original English translation of this recipe from the 1558 edition of
Alessio gives this recipe slightly differently:

Take Aluminis catini is what the earlier edition says.
later on it specifies "floure of Amylum, and an unce of Romayne
Vitrioll, or redde leade well beaten into poulder..."

   From "The Second Booke of Secretes" Fol. 54

You might survey some other editions and check to see if the ingredients
change or spellings differ.

See my recent TI article for more on Alessio. This edition is available
as a facsimile reprint.
The Secretes of the Reuerende Mayster Alexis of Piemount. London. STC
(2nd ed.) / 295. Facsimile by Walter J. Johnson, Inc. of Norwood, New
Jerse and Theatrum Orbis Terrarum, Ltd. of Amsterdam. 1975. ISBN: 90
221 0707 8.

Johnnae llyn Lewis

Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 10:43:51 -0500
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] The mystery soap ingredient in context
To: "'sca-cooks at ansteorr.org'" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

I think in this context "aluminic casini" should be translated as "rock alum
of Cassino."  Which means this is probably aluminum potssium sulfate or
aluminum sodium sulfate, commonly extracted from alumina ores and made into
styptic pencils.  There are several mines in Italy that have been operating
since at least the 16th Century.

The town of Casinium, located where the Abbey of Monte Cassino now stands,
has the remains of a amphitheater made of "opus reticul alum" or "major
veined alum," which means more alum per ton and suggests that alum was  
mined in the vicinity.

The "blue vitriol" is a hydrous solution of copper sulfate

That the recipe is a hair soap is interesting, because alum and copper
sulfate are used in some modern shampoos.

Bear

Date Thu, 25 Sep 2003 09:07:24 -0700
From: Susan Fox-Davis <selene at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] A mystery ingredient in a soap recipe
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius wrote:
> I just spoke to a friend (a chemist) who suspects it's aluminic
> caseinate (IOW, named in that it somehow pertains to cheese).

I find one mention of aluminum caseinate ona page about lactose
intolerance and additives:

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/stevecarper/guide.htm

Caseinates are milk proteins and show up in soap to promote foaming.  If
I had not seen the period recipe I would have thought this was a very modern formula.

Selene Colfox, google-maniac

From: Elizabeth Young <lizyoung@fenris.net>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Mediaeval Things to Do with Old Oil?
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 18:38:06 GMT

Robert Uhl wrote:
> alchem@en.com (James Koch) writes:
> 
>>I suppose you could use the stuff to make soap.  The type of soap you
>>would obtain would depend on the type of plant or plants from which
>>the oil was expressed.
> 
> I'd thought only animal fat worked for soap, but I guess that doesn't
> really make a lot of sense.

I've used Crisco (solid vegetable oil) to make soap.
There has got to be a process for cleaning used oil, but I can't think 
what it might be. I know that tallow (animal fat) has to be rendered 
before using for soap, but I can't remember what that process is either.
Fat (ha ha) lot of good I am!

liz young

From: Elizabeth Young <lizyoung@fenris.net>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Mediaeval Things to Do with Old Oil?
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2004 06:15:10 GMT

David J. Hughes wrote:
> Elizabeth Young wrote:
>> Robert Uhl wrote:
>>> alchem@en.com (James Koch) writes:
>>>
>>>> I suppose you could use the stuff to make soap.  The type of soap you
>>>> would obtain would depend on the type of plant or plants from which
>>>> the oil was expressed.
>>>
>>> I'd thought only animal fat worked for soap, but I guess that doesn't
>>> really make a lot of sense.
>>
>> I've used Crisco (solid vegetable oil) to make soap.

> Liquid oil used to make lye soap will produce liquid soap, rather than 
> bars.
> 
> David Gallowglass

Sodium hydroxide makes solid soap even with liquid oil, potassium 
hydroxide (which I have not tried) makes liquid soap in at least some cases.

liz young

<the end>

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