Title: goat-msg
Subject: Period goat dishes. Cooking goat. Recipes.
Author: Edited by Mark S. Harris
Last saved by: Mark S. Harris
Keywords: medieval, goat, recipe, period, cooking, reference

goat-msg – 12/14/17

Period goat dishes. Cooking goat. Recipes.

NOTE: See also the files: butch-goat-art, lamb-mutton-msg, roast-pork-msg, sausages-msg, stews-bruets-msg, venison-msg.

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    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 16:45:05 EST
From: LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com>
Subject: SC - Goat Recipe

Goat in the Style of the Bahgdad Cookery Book
Copyright 1997 by L. J. Spencer, Jr.)

Serves 150.

2 goats, deboned, meat cubed
20 lbs. onion, chopped
4 bunches fresh coriander, chopped
4 heaping tablespoons ground cumin
3 cps olive oil
Salt to taste
2 tablspoons graound black pepper
1 gal. vinegar (I used cider vinegar because date vinegar was unavailable)
Water to cover

Heat oil in a  deep four burner pan. Add onions and fry, stirring often until
translucent. Add meat cubes. Brown on all sides. Add remaining ingredients.
Bring to a boil; reheat to simmer. Cook for several hours until meat is tender
and liquid reduces to almost nothing. Taste and adjust seasonings. Serve with
flat bread. (May also be served over rice.)

Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 21:53:02 EST
From: LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Goat Recipe

<< approximately how much meat does one get from two goats, please?? >>

aproximately 20-30 lbs. For the purpose of experimentation it would safe to
assume that each person recieved approximately 1/4 lb. of meat more or less....

Since I showed up at the event with the goat meat already done and "eyeballed
it, so to speak, a good place to start would be a half onion per lb of meat. I
wrote things down for the recipe as I went along having only the original (
which I will post when I find it.) to work from at the event. Sorry for the
mass recipe. :-)

Ras

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 98 02:09:31 PST
From: "Alderton, Philippa" <phlip at morganco.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Specialty meats (was re:  white shield feast)

Hey, Stefan,

We had a bit of a thread on goat a while back. Here is one of the recipes I
collected.:

Good day to all, from Allegra Beati.  My version of the following recipe,
from Platina, has been a huge success both in the SCA and even among my
very non-SCA family.

The recipe calls for kid, but I remember seeing something in my studies of
humoural theory in period that lamb is an acceptable substitute for kid.
Boneless leg of lamb is easily obtained in Albuquerque, NM (I get mine at
Costco, the price varying a little throughout the year), and I use that in
this version. Obtaining the baby goat is a problem (unless you want to
order the entire 35-pound critter).  I've heard rumors of goat being
traditional to some hispanic festivals here in the Rio Grande Valley, but
I'm unaware of the time of year these festivals take place and which
markets are most likely to carry goat.  It's a shame-- I love both goat
and lamb!

I'm sorry that I can only give you the recipe as translated-- I cook like
the recipes read.  I'm not a "measuring" cook by any means, although since
starting a cookery group here, I've been making a habit of writing down
procedures and quantities for future reference (and future cooks!)  I
suppose that means I'll have to make this dish again soon....

Making the leg of lamb in advance for a camping event is quite simple-- I
wrap the cooked roast in foil, seal-a-meal it, and stick it in the
freezer.  I also put the cooked juices in a plastic container, and freeze
them as well.  At the event, I allow time for the frozen lamb to thaw, and
then slice it and warm it in a covered dutch oven with the saved juices.

Although I don't have a copy here, I've always used the general
temperature and timetable instructions for lamb as given in _The Joy of
Cooking_.

>From _De Honesta Voluptate_, by Platina (Mallinckrodt edition):

        KID IN GARLIC

Grease a whole kid or the fourth part of one, with lard and cleaned garlic
cloves; put it on a spit and turn it near the fire.  Baste it often with
sprigs of bay leaf or rosemary and the sauce which I am about to describe.
Take verjuice and the rich juice of the meat, the yolks of two eggs well
beaten, two cloves of garlic well pounded, a dash of saffron and a little
pepper and mix this all together and pour it into a dish.  With this (as I
said), you baste what you are cooking.  When it is cooked, put it into a
dish and pour part of the sauce over it and sprinkle with finely chopped
parsley.  This food, when it is well cooked, should be served quickly and
not let cool.

phlip at morganco.net

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:11:33 EST
From: LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com>
Subject: SC - Goat

stefan at texas.net writes:
<< I don’t remember goat being mentioned very much before here.>>

Actually goat has been mentioned several times in this forum.

The Middle east, Greece, and Western Europe immediately come to mind.

 <<Does anyone have any good medieval recipes for goat? >>

al-Baghdadi has savral recipes specifically calling for the use of "kid" and
many recipes which specify "meat" generically. The generic "meat" can be
camel, goat, lamb, mutton or whatever.

<<Considering that we do have some tex-mex resturants that do serve cabrito, I
can probably find goat meat here in central Texas.>>

It should also be available at any of a number of Middle Eastern or Greek
specialty markets, your local livestock auction or through newspaper adds
under the heading "Livestock" (which is where I got the two that I used for my
Middle Eastern feast.

 <<Stefan li Rous >>

Ras

Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 16:50:30 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Feast Slaughtering

At 8:45 PM -0500 3/20/98, LrdRas wrote (in re some goats):
>All in all it was an educational experience but I think that whenever budget
>allows, I would rather let the butcher do his job.
>
>Ras

Reminds me of a story...

One of the active people in my last group is a wholesale butcher.  We were
doing a cooking workshop, and I wanted to try the recipe for roast kid
(i.e. young goat) from Platina, so I asked him if he could supply us one.
Sure, no problem.  Was he coming to the workshop? Probably.  "Well", I
said, "let me know if you won't be coming, and I will drive out Friday and
pick it up."  At the time, my sister Johanna shared the house with us.  She
does not believe in eating red meat. Friday, while I was out shopping for
the workshop, Johanna answered the doorbell to find a stranger (one of my
friend's employees) on the doorstep with a bloodstained apron and a large
object in his arms.  "Lady, where do you want your goat?"  When I got home,
my sister informed me tartly that the next time I arranged for large dead
animals to be delivered to the house in my absence, she would appreciate
some warning.

Elizabeth

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:29:09 EDT
From: Mordonna22 at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Goat roast help requested

cnevin at caci.co.uk writes:
>  I've offered to do a goat roast for some friends and take along the sauces I
>  made at the Shire workshop last weekend. Have the goat, but have never
>  cooked this particular beastie myself before. I understand it can be tough.
>  Does anyone have any advice or pointers? Should I boil it for a while before
>  roasting or what?
>  
>  Lucretzia

My suggestion would be to cut into quarters, rub well with oil, salt, pepper,
garlic, and herbs, cover with aluminum foil, pierce the foil several times,
and roast slowly over your favorite flavor of hardwood.

Mordonna

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:42:19 -0700
From: "Wanda Pease" <wandapease at bigfoot.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Goat roast help requested

My household has a tradition of doing a goat roast every summer
(mildly evil reason).  Since one member has a rosemary tree (yes,
TREE, no bush has any right to be _that_ big!), and we all have a
passion for garlic, we larded the meat with both rosemary and garlic
slivers, marinated it in vinegar/pepper/honey for a day, and then
cooked it slowly in a browning bag.  It was supposed to be cooked on a
grill, but we're in Portland, Oregon, and sunshine in early summer is
a problematic thing.

Came out Yummy!
Regina

Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 21:28:14 EST
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: SC - Recipe 8-Weekend of Wisdom

This recipe was problematical from the beginning.  I was unsure whether the
almonds that were soaked in the water were to be used for the almond milk or
not but considering the further instructions regarding frying them, I chose
to interpret this as another part of the recipe. My decision was based on the
fact in my experience toasted almonds simply do not make acceptable almond
milk.

Elysant made the pastry for this recipe with things at hand and it was very
flaky and tasty. The pies were served near the end of the feast so a lot was
returned to the kitchen. This was not a problem because a line of people
showed up asking if they could take the pies home with them so that in the
end none were left.

I was very disappointed in this recipe because the goat meat came from 2
different animals. Animals that apparently were not the same age. The
finished product contained both very tender pieces of meat and less tender
ones. Over all the flavor was wonderful and I would recommend this dish if
you can get meat from a single animal or at least ones that are close to the
same age.

GOAT
(Editor's Note: Goat in Winter)
(redacted from a recipe in Traite de Cuisine [c. 1300 CE] from A. Collection
of Medieval and Renaissance Cookbooks, Vol. II, ed. Duke Sir Cariadoc of the
Bow. Translation by Janet Hinson)
Redaction copyright 1999 L. J. Spencer, Jr.

Original recipe:
Loin of goat should be roasted or served in pastry, lightly larded, with hot
pepper or garlic sauce. In winter, prepare with garlic and cinnamon and
ginger, moistened with milk of almonds, the almonds moistened with warm
water, and fried in lard or baconfat, and the sauce inside.

2 lb. Goat, cubed
1 Pie shells and tops
4 cloves Garlic
1/2 tsp. True cinnamon, ground
1/4 tsp. Ginger, ground
1 cp. Almond milk
1 handful   Whole almonds, soaked in warm water, drained
2 T Lard
Salt to taste

Mash garlic.  Mix garlic, cinnamon, ginger and almond milk together.  Salt to
taste.
Parboil goat cubes for 15 minutes.  Drain.

Drain soaked almonds. Melt lard in a pan and fry almonds until golden brown.

Put parboiled goat cubes into shell.  Pour one cup almond milk mixture over
top of each pie.  Sprinkle with almonds.  Put on cover crust, sealing edges
well.  Make a small vent hole in the top of each crust.  Using the trimmed
edges of the dough, make fanciful shapes and decorate the top of the pie with
the shapes, sealing with water.  Bake at 350 deg F until crust is a golden
brown.

Ras

Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 22:53:55 -0500
From: "Richard Kappler II" <rkappler at home.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Glazed Lamb with garlic and rosemary

For all who asked:

Haedus in Alio (glazed Leg of Lamb (or kid) with Garlic and Rosemary
Pleyn Delit 102 (Platina 6)

Grease a kid or a quarter of one with lard and cleaned garlic cloves; put it
on a spit and turn it by the fire.  Baste it often with sprigs of bay or
rosemary and the sauce I shall now describe.  Take verjuice and the juice of
the meat, the yolks of two eggs well beaten, two cloves of garlic well
pounded, a pinch of saffron and a little pepper, and mix this and pour into
a dish.  With this (as I said) you baste what you are cooking.  When it is
done, put it in a dish and pour some of the sauce over it and sprinkle with
finely chopped parsley.

cooking notes:
Since the verjuice I ordered a couple of weeks ago is not yet in, and I had
much else going on, plus other recipes to redact, I just cooked the roast
exactly as Hieatt et al redacted in Pleyn Delit.  Basically what you do is
set the oven at 450, coat the roast with olive oil (lightly), rub with a
clove of garlic and put it in the oven.  Ten minutes later, reduce heat to
325.  With mortar and pestle, powder 1/2 tsp rosemary, 1/4 tsp black pepper
and a goodly pinch of saffron.  Once this is well powdered, add two garlic
cloves and make it into a paste, then add two well beaten egg yolks and
juice of 1/2 a lemon.  About 35 minutes after the lamb went into the oven,
take it out, add drippings to your sauce, mix well, paint the lamb with the
glaze, throw it back in the oven.  Repeat every 15 minutes, adding drippings
to sauce before basting/painting, until lamb reaches an internal temp of
150.  At this point, turn the oven off, but leave the roast in until ready
to serve.  When you take the roast out, add all the drippings to your sauce,
mix well, pour over roast, sprinkle with parsley, slice and serve.  YUMMY!

regards, Puck

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2000 17:03:09 -0700
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Herbs for spit-roasting meat?

At 4:37 PM -0400 10/9/00, harper at idt.net wrote:
>It seems to me that sometime, somewhere, I read that one way to
>flavor spit-roasted meat was to thwack it with bundles of herbs
>while it was roasting.  Does anyone know if this was done in
>period?  And where references to it might be?
>
>Lady Brighid ni Chiarain

There is a Platina recipe where you are using the herbs to baste a 
roast kid (yes, I mean young goat) with a sauce; here it is.

Kid in Garlic
Platina Book 6 p. 97 (Falconwood edition)

Grease a whole kid or the fourth part of one, with lard and cleaned 
garlic cloves; put it on a spit and turn it near the fire.  Baste it 
often with sprigs of bay leaf or rosemary and the sauce which I am 
about to describe.  Take verjuice and the rich juice of the meat, the 
yolks of two eggs well beaten, two cloves of garlic well pounded, a 
dash of saffron and a little pepper and mix this all together and 
pour it into a dish.  With this (as I said) you baste what you are 
cooking.  When it is cooked, put it into a dish and pour part of the 
sauce over it and sprinkle with finely chopped parsley.  This food, 
when it is well cooked, should be served quickly and not let cool.

Elizabeth/Betty Cook

From: "Glenn Crawford" <gacrwfrd at hotmail.com>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Question to the group....
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 10:58:26 -0400

I found these recipes in an on-line cookbook "a Gode Boke"
http://www.godecookery.com/godeboke/godeboke.htm
I don't know if it is a true medieval cookbook or not but it worked for me.

Half Kede Rosted with Green Sauce
[This "Kede Rosted" is from Harleian MS 4016.]

4 to 6 pound kid or lamb roast
1/2 C wine vinegar
Salt to taste
1. Preheat oven to 450=B0.

2. Place roast on a rack in a roasting pan, fat side up, and put in oven.
Immediately reduce heat to 325=B0. Roast for thirty minutes per pound or until
internal temperature reaches 180 degrees.

3. Carve the roast, and put the meat into a serving dish. Sprinkle with
vinegar and salt before serving.

Green Sauce for Lamb
[This is from Ashmole MS 1429]

1 C wine vinegar
1/2 C finely minced scallions
1/2 C finely minced parsley
1/2 tsp salt
1/2 tsp powdered ginger
1. Combine all ingredients in a bowl, and allow to marinate for about an
hour before serving. Serve over lamb cut into bite-sized pieces.

Yields one cup of sauce.

Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 15:54:33 -0500
From: "a5foil" <a5foil at ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goats
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

> Is goat period?

Well, um ... lots of recipes for kid in 14th century Catalunya.

Cynara

Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:23:56 -0500
From: "Martin G. Diehl" <mdiehl at nac.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goats
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

The Borg wrote:
> Is goat period?

Platina; "On Right Pleasure and Good Health";

"The chapters of the Fourth Book" (Quarti Libri Capitula)

24. On she-goat and kid (24 De capra et haedo)

"The chapters of the Sixth Book" (Sexti Libri Capitula)

25. Kid in garlic (25 Haedus in allio)

"On a spit over a fire turn a whole kid or a quarter, with
bits of lard and cloves of clean garlic stuck all around it.
Moisten frequently, with sprigs of bay or rosemary, with the
seasoning which I will now describe.  With verjuice and rich
sauce, mix two well-beaten egg yolks, two well-pounded cloves
of garlic, a bit of saffron, and a little pepper and put into
a pan.  Then, as I have said, sprinkle it on what is cooking,
and when it is cooked, put in a dish, and pour in part of the
sauce, then sprinkle with finely cut parsley."  .. and ends
with the admonition,  "This dish, well-cooked, ought to be
eaten quickly so it does not get cold."

Obviously not a SCAdian ... he knows nothing about how
the pace of an event can deviate from his expectations.

My hardcover copy of Platina was translated by Mary Ella
Milham -- I purchased my copy from Poison Pen Press
http://www.poisonpenpress.com/
while attending the Guilded Pearl event held at the
Barony of An Dubhaigeainn.

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill Fisher" <liamfisher at gmail.com>
> To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
> Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 12:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goats
>
>> On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 21:20:09 -0600, Lisa
>> <silvina at allegiance.tv> wrote:
>>> *snip*
>>>
>>>> While I think them tasty as kid and will bow to their
>>>> prowess in removing unwanted vegetation goats do
>>>> occasionally present problems.  What problems you ask?

[snip]

>>>> Daniel

>>> *snip*

>>> lol aye, they do like to climb, especially on cars.
>>> And yes they do leave nasty dents and also scratches
>>> ... but if you're not around cars, like out in a
>>> backyard, they're great :)
>>>
>>> Lady Elizabeta of Rundel
>>
>> If the goat dents your cars, eat it.
>> Cadoc

> From Platina; "On Right Pleasure and Good Health"; Book IV,
Chapter 24. On she-goat and kid (24 De capra et haedo)

"Their gnawing is deadly to a tree, and, by licking, they
also make the olive barren, which is why they are
sacrificed to Minerva.

Do not eat the meat of a she-goat or smelly he-goat.  Eat
kid, for nothing else is considered more nourishing among
the domestic animals, for it has little indigestible residue
in it, is easily digested, nourishes well, generates good
blood, balanced between warmth and coolness"

I am,
Lord Vincenzo Martino Mazza,
-- 
Martin G. Diehl

Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 19:55:22 -0500
From: Daniel Myers <edouard at medievalcookery.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goats
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

On Nov 7, 2004, at 2:22 PM, The Borg wrote:
> Is goat period?

In a word, yes.  Here are a few goat recipes I found on a quick search:

Forme of Cury

Egurdouce. XXI. Tke Conynges or Kydde and smyte hem on pecys rawe. and
frye hem in white grece. take raysouns of Coraunce and fry hem take
oynouns parboile hem and hewe hem small and fry hem. take rede wyne
suger with powdour of peper. of gynger of canel. salt. and cast þrto.
and lat it seeþ with a gode quantite of white grece an serue it forth.

Brewet Of Almony. XX.II. VII. Take Conynges or kiddes and hewe hem
small on moscels oþer on pecys. parboile hem with the same broth, drawe
an almaunde mylke and do the fleissh þewith, cast þerto powdour
galyngale & of gynger with flour of Rys. and colour it wiþ alkenet.
boile it, salt it. & messe it forth with sugur and powdour douce.

Libro di cucina/ Libro per cuoco (L. Smithson, trans.)

LII - Pastry of kid good. To make pasty of meat of kid take the meat
and cut small and make the crust and put inside the meat with powdered
cinnamon and pieces of lard; then when it is cooked put in broth and
rose water and let it boil together.

LXXXI - Green sauce for kid and other boiled mats. Take parsley and
ginger and cloves and cinnamon flowers and a little salt and pound
every thing together and temper with good vinegar; make that it is
temperate and they won't want to wait to taste.

Le Menagier de Paris (J. Hinson, trans.)

AN HERB MEAT DISH FOR FOUR PEOPLE. If you have killed a goat, you can
make a dish of the first stomach (and the other stomachs?), etc., in
yellow sauce with bacon and liver, lungs, pluck and other tripes. Cook
them very well in water, then chop with two knives a for puree, and
chop them up very small, or grind them in the mortar with sage or mint,
etc., as above.

Wel ende edelike spijse (C. Muusers, trans.)

Kid and lamb. Cut in small pieces and boil them in wine. Add parsley
and bacon enough, chop it finely. Add] enough saffron, ginger [and]
cinnamon to it, and egg yolks fried in it. Eat them with green sauce.

- Doc

Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2006 11:48:36 -0800
From: "Nick Sasso" <grizly at mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Sca-cooks] Any good Lamb recipes?
To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

I have a great recipe from "Neopolitan Cuisine" (Scully) that is intended
got kid, but I substituted Lamb.  It is a braised, stewy thing that I served
over/with a starch.  Three separate thickeners, and it was spectacularly
rich and filling.  It cooks VERY well in a table top roaster in a few hours.
You can find it webbed with original text, Scully's translation, and my
version .at:

http://franiccolo.home.mindspring.com/ 
carne_de_capretto_in_tegamo_alla_fiorentina.html

I prepared it for 170 or so at an event and nothing came back.  It converted
several avowed lamb despisers as well.  The melded flavors are  
greater than the sum of its parts.

Monchalet:
http://franiccolo.home.mindspring.com/monchalet_forme_of_curye.html

niccolo difrancesco

Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2006 08:53:34 -0500
From: "RUTH EARLAND" <rtannahill at verizon.net>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: cooking with kids
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Well, the goat ones, anyway.

We've served kid at feast before.

All I can say: use common sense. Goat is a fairly lean meat. You need to be
careful to keep it from drying out. Lamb is a fairly good analagous meat,
except for the fact that commercially available lamb usually contains more
fat than goat. Look at the cuts you are going to use. If it has enough fat,
you can probably roast it, but if it's typical, braising, stewing, or
otherwise cooking in liquid is a good idea.

Look to cultures that routinely incorporate goat for inspiration. A lot of
the modern recipes for goat call for long, slow cooking in liquid.

Berelinde

Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 07:40:45 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] NYT article on goats
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

The New York Times carried an article yesterday on grass fed goats
being provided for sale for meat.
"With Goat, a Rancher Breaks Away From the Herd" 
<http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/15/dining/15goat.html?ref=dining>
It lists sources for goat meat and discusses the differences.

Johnnae

Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 05:55:27 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] new title: Goat: Meat, Milk, Cheese

Back in February, we discussed on the list the problems with finding  
sources for goat meat. (We've also discussed goat cheeses in the past too.)
I came across a new book on the topic yesterday which people may find  
interesting.

Bruce Weinstein and Mark Scarbrough.  Goat: Meat, Milk, Cheese

(Stewart, Tabori & Chang; $29.95) It came out this month. Description  
reads: "From appearances at the most high-end restaurants to street  
food carts coast-to-coast, goat meat and dairy products are being  
embraced across the country as the next big thing. With its excellent  
flavor, wide-ranging versatility, and numerous health benefits, goat  
meat, milk, and cheese are being sought by home cooks. And while goat  
is the world?s primary meat (upwards of 70 percent of the red meat  
eaten around the world is goat) never before has there been a cookbook  
on this topic in the United States. Goat is a no-holds-barred  
goatapedia, laugh-out-loud cooking class, cheesemaking workshop, and  
dairy-milking expedition all in one."

Amazon is pairing it with another book called Getting Your Goat: The  
Gourmet Guide by Patricia A Moore from 2009.

Johnnae

<the end>

Edited by Mark S. Harris	goat-msg	Page  of