Puritans-msg - 2/22/02
The Puritan movement of the 16th and 17th centuries. The founding of the Plimoth Plantation. Their clothing, lifestyle and beliefs.
NOTE: See also the files: religion-msg, heretics-msg, England-msg, p-bibles-msg, indulgences-msg, dyeing-msg.
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NOTICE -
This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.
The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.
Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).
Thank you,
Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: XvLoverCrimvX at aol.com
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2001 10:27:47 EDT
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Canadian Friends
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
lcm at efn.org writes:
> A challenge for you Misha- go to the library, and do some reading. See
> if you can find 4 or 5 things about the Puritans that surprise you and
> are different from what you'd expect. And see if you can draw a line of
> thought that helps you understand their role in the formation of our
> nation. Report back. I for one would be interested in seeing what you
> think is important about the Puritans in 17th c. America.
>
> 'Lainie
> frustrated history teacher strikes again...
Well, from what I know of my English and History class the Puritans were a
strict religious group in England that wanted to purify the Church of England
to a more simplier style of worship than the more elaborate church of
England. Their attempts to form and create a theocracy in Massachusetts was
called the Puritan Experiment. William Bradford was their first leader I
think both in England and the New World. To escape religious prosecution and
intolerance, they fled to Holland and then to the United States where the
caught the name:Pilgrim. The ship they fled on was no other than the
Mayflower. On the Mayflower they formed a document called the Mayflower
Compact which essentially outlined how they would be governed. This was the
grandfather to our American Constitution. Many ministers and members of the
"elect" had great influence in the government.
The literature of the Puirtans was in a plain style which told about
diaries and journals of self examination and the Bible. They believed that
writing about anything else would lead to temptation and would lure them into
the hands of the Devil. A Puritan woman was the first poet in America:Anne
Bradstreet. In her poem "Here follow some verses upon the burning down of our
house, July 10, 1666", she gives many allusions to the Bible such as Job 1:21
"The lord hath given, and the lord hath took. Blessed be the name of the
lord". But her poetry did deal a lot about the Bible, love for her husband,
public events, and her children. Her major source of influence of her poems
was none other than William Shakespeare. The Scarlet letter by Nathaniel
Hawthorne was about one of his ancesters that was convicted with adultry and
therefore was made to wear the Scarlet letter A forever, unless she told who
the father was.
The religion of the Puritans was very strict and dealt heavily with
self-examination to see if you were one of the "elect". They were Calvanists
who believed in predestination. But to see God's work, you must repent of
your sin and keep your mind and hands busy so the Devil wouldn't tempt you.
They believed the Devil was all around you and always tempting you. They were
a very susperstitious group of people. The quote I sort of sarcasitcally used
was to represent a "hellfire and brimstone preacher" known as Jonathan
Edwards. His most famous sermon was called "Sinners in the hands of an angry
God" which compared a ship sinking in damned waters, a bow and arrow piercing
a heart, and a lead weight pushing down on you to God's wrath. His sermons
brought out fear of damnation to the people which took the religion out too
far. The Salem Witch trials showed how the Puritan religion was pushed too
far because of the oppression of women. Let me talk about the Salem Withc
trials. The first convicted in the SWT was Sarah Osborne and Sarah Good, two
unpopular women who did not go to church so they had to be witches, right?
Well, both were hanged as well as 17 others. The Salem Witch trials slowly
diminished when a Puritan Minister recited the Lords Prayer perfectly before
being hanged.
I'm not going to go but so in depth cause my hands are hurting. But you
could say the influence of the Puritans gave us the American Constitution and
many great literary works.
Misha
Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2001 15:02:03 -0700
From: "Laura C. Minnick" <lcm at efn.org>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Puritans, was: Canadian Friends
Etain1263 at aol.com wrote:
> lcm at efn.org writes:
> << The idea of a Puritan persona could be kinda cool, though I can see two
> drawbacks: do you really want to wear very simple unrelieved black and
> white for your SCA career? >>
>
> Actually..the Puritans wore many colors. All solids, and mostly
> "neutrals"..but they ran the gamut from tan to dark brown...with yellows and
> such. The sorts of dyes that we would find "naturally". (and the dyers know
> what THAT means!) Simple styles in simple colors..but not "all black, all
> the time".
Ok, so I was overreaching for a point. But I don't think you'll find a
Puritan in an Elizabethan with pearls and lace and... you know.
I understand that they did have colored dyes, but that they were 'sad'
colors- 'sad' dyes are a little muddier and deeper toned, IIRC from the
addition of iron to the dyebath. I'm sure one of the dying folks on the
list can elaborate. However, this is why their clothes were referred to
as 'sad'- not because they were depressed.
I wouldn't be able to take it- give me orange! and red! and bright
yellow! None of these muted colors for me! Woo-hoo!
'Lainie
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2001 18:47:44 -0400
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
From: Barbara Nostrand <nostrand at acm.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Canadian Friends
Greetings from Solveig! I was once told that one of things that got
the puritans kicked out of England was parading down the streets of
London in the nude. You see, they were pure in mind and body and did
not need the clothes of the impure or some such thing.
Compacts governing colonies were actually pretty common. If I recall
correctly, the Mayflower people were not the first to operate under
a compact.
Solveig Throndardottir
Amateur Scholar
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM |
| deMoivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
| mailto:nostrand at acm.org | mailto:bnostran at lynx.neu.edu |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------+
Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2001 17:46:10 -0700
From: Morses3 at aol.com
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2001 21:01:37 EDT
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
As a researcher for my family genealogy society with a very long New England
history, this is a topic I've read a lot on before. The web site above from
the living history museum at Plimoth Plantation, widely regarded as one of
the most accurate in the world at portraying the details of a certain
historical time and place, details clothing worn by ordinary people of
Plimoth Plantation, most of whom were not Puritans, but wore the same
clothing that the Puritans wore as well.
Most of the "black and white" Puritan stuff came from the 19th century
writers and artists romanticizing their ancestors of "olden tymes", but
remember that many European Puritans before emigrating wore black and white
as a symbol of their wealth and fiscal soundness to prove they were the
chosen ones in the eyes of God. It was more difficult to retain a deep black
dye in an era without chemicals and thus more costly to be seen wearing black
clothing highlighted with hard to care for-clean- white linens......even in
that case though, it would have been for their "best" clothing, reserved for
church and special occasions, not commonly for everyday wear.
Since this is a food list and I don't want to be guilty of non-food content,
there are also good links on the Plimoth Plantation web site for 17th century
New World food, including some recipes, and of course these are only a few
years out of our period.
Gervase
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2001 19:51:18 -0400
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Canadian Friends
From: Elizabeth A Heckert <spynnere at juno.com>
On Sat, 6 Oct 2001 10:36:21 EDT XvLoverCrimvX at aol.com writes:
> Therefore, could you have a Puritan persona
>because it is in the limits of the SCA?
>
>Misha
Misha, my late persona happens to be a Covenanter who floats about
between London and Edinburgh, 'cause I can't decide which city I like
better--and Covenenters are Scots.
Jean Calvin (also John) was born in 1509 and died 1564. He preached
in France and Switzerland. John Knox was a prominent Scottish minister.
His dates are 1507-72. It's an entirely reasonable choice for a persona,
as in being within the SCA period, altho' some folks might think it odd.
Elizabeth
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2001 20:05:02 -0400
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Puritans, was: Canadian Friends
From: Elizabeth A Heckert <spynnere at juno.com>
On Sat, 06 Oct 2001 10:24:59 -0700 "Laura C. Minnick" <lcm at efn.org>
writes:
>The idea of a Puritan persona could be kinda cool, though I can see
>two drawbacks: do you really want to wear very simple unrelieved black
>and white for your SCA career?
Lainie,
I have a lovely colour photocopy of a painting of a Huguenot (ie.
French Calvinists) church service. Lots of people are wearing black, but
the latter half of the sixteenth century had a fashion vogue for dark
colours. And almost as popular in that print are red and pink. I have
it for precisely these moments (grin!). Sober dress does not necessarily
refer to colour.
Reference your paragraph about the rest of their lives--it does apply
to the dress as well. The Protestants of the late sixteenth-early
seventeenth century have a bad rep, I realize, but we tend to hear the
extreme arguements, not the vast middle.
Elizabeth
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2001 20:31:02 -0400
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Puritans
From: Elizabeth A Heckert <spynnere at juno.com>
On Sat, 06 Oct 2001 20:32:07 -0500 Stefan li Rous <stefan at texas.net>
writes:
>However, it could be limiting if you do it in an accurate way. I doubt
>the Puritans would be partying or dancing as many wish to do at SCA
>events. Did they make alcohol or drink it?
There is a *lovely* book called *The Anatomy of Abuses* by a man
whose last name is Stubbs, and I believe his first name is Phillip. In
it he deplores everything that makes life fun, from cosmetics to clothes,
and (I think) food.
Stubbs was a conservative English Protestant, and the only way I've
been able to find any of this work is in excerpt in other works, as the
only available ILL editions are on microfilm, and the library I use
doesn't have a reader.
<http://www.dnaco.net/~aleed/corsets/general/html.>; has some of his
clothing comments.
But the thing is, if he had to complain about everyone doing this,
that and the other, that means *of course* Puritans were doing those
things also. If all your brethern are good, holy and meek, then you
don't need to chastise them.
If the Puritans refused alcohol, what would they have drunk??? Water
wasn't drunk much, and milk was still more important as cheese and
butter.
There were bad Puritans, and evil Puritans, but there were good
Puritans as well. If we succumb to historical stereotypes, we're doing
no good service to the truth of history.
Elizabeth
Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2001 15:21:06 -0400
From: johnna holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Puritans and Pilgrims
There are a number of differences between
Puritans and Pilgrims.
To summarize as given by 1620 Society website
at http://www.sail1620.org/m2k/history/pnotp.htm
(This is given as a comparison chart on the website
so I've had to retype it. )
PILGRIMS
Arrived 1620 under Governors Carver and Bradford.
Founded Plymouth Colony. Friendly with Indians for
40 years. Paid Indians for land. Communal living
for the first 7 years. Seized Indian lands.
Democratic, consensus of the governed. Separated
from the Church of England. Not a single prosecution
of witchcraft. Representation and equal inheritance.
Forerunner of US Constitution & Declaration of Independence.
More tolerant than the Church of England.
Puritans
Arrived 1630 under Governor Winthrop, founding the
Massachusetts Bay Colony. Indian problems from the outset.
Seized Indian lands. Individual profit from the outset.
Authoritarian. "Purified" the Church from within.
Prosecuted and executed for witchcraft. Intolerant.
If you will note on that website, the 1620 group went so
far as to even draft a proclamation saying that the Pilgrims
weren't Puritans back in 1960.
See also: http://www.gospelcom.net/ligonier/tt/tt-11-96/logan.html
for another discussion or run a google search
on (pilgrams, puritans, differences) for a number
of discussions.
Johnna Holloway Johnnae llyn Lewis
Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2001 16:01:51 -0400
From: johnna holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org, Elizabeth A Heckert <spynnere at juno.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Puritans
I am sorry that the libraries in your area
have failed you, Elizabeth. As a librarian
with an undergrad degree in history (my
senior honors course was on Tudor/Stuart
Women), I can see where you might like to
read more from Stubbes than excerpts.
Stubbes and his
anatomie/anatomy should be available to you
in a printed format. There have been a number
of reprints in hardback, including one in-print
110.00 dollar one that is currently available
by special order. Here are two editions.
Philip Stubbes. THE ANATOMIE OF ABUSES. printed
in London by R. Jones in 1583.
New York : Walter J. Johnson Incorporated,
in 1972 as part of the series titled
English Experience Ser.; No. 489;
ISBN: 9022104893 Trade Cloth;
At least 100 libraries report owning this volume.
Another edition is titled: The anatomy of abuses,
by New York, Johnson Reprint Corp., 1972.
at least 51 libraries report owning this edition.
If you want to read it in full, I'd suggest the
Walter Johnson edition.
Johnna Holloway Johnnae llyn Lewis
Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2001 16:50:11 -0400
From: Tara Sersen Boroson <tsersen at nni.com>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Puritans
Elizabeth, University of Delaware's library has the Stubbes book, so you
should be able to ILL it. If you can't, let me know and I can try to
get ahold of it for you since you're fairly local. Are you going to
Kingdom Crusades? It's listing is below.
-Magdalena
AUTHOR: Stubbes, Phillip.
TITLE: The anatomie of abuses: contayning a discoverie, or briefe
summarie of such notable vices and imperfections, as now
raigne in many Christian countreyes of the worlde: but
(especiallie) in a verie famous ilande called Ailgna:
together, with most fearefull examples of Gods iudgementes,
executed vpon the wicked for the same, aswell in Ailgna of
late, as in other places, elsewhere... London, Printed by R.
Iones, 1583.
PUBLISHED: <Amsterdam, Theatrum Orbis Terrarum; New York, Da Capo
Press,1972>
SUBJECTS: Theater--Moral and ethical aspects.
England--Social life and customs--16th century.
<the end>